Some comments about comments and other ramblings about Project Jasper

re: Some comments about comments and other ramblings about Project Jasper

lb — Sat, 12 May 2007 07:49:22 GMT

ha ha. thanks for reading! (i feel a little embarrased though ;-))

one question i've got -- is there a connection between blinq and jasper?

re: Some comments about comments and other ramblings about Project Jasper

rogerj — Sat, 12 May 2007 19:31:37 GMT

secretGeek has a valid point about the SQL Server-only limitation of Jasper.

If Microsoft intends to live up to its committment that a primary feature of the Entity Framework is "The ability to query relational stores other than the Microsoft SQL Server family of products" it behooves the ADO.NET team to extend this capability to Entity Framework derivatives, such as Jasper and Astoria (which also has an SQL Server 2005 requirement for the toolkit). Microsoft must clarify that the SQL Server 2005-only limitation applies only to the early "incubator project" releases and not to the final release, if there is one. Failing that is "crying wolf"—no developer or RDBMS vendor will believe that the Entity Framework will be RDBMS-agnostic when Microsoft says Katmai will deliver the Entity Data Platform.

--rj

See the 5/12/2007 update to http://oakleafblog.blogspot.com/2007/05/using-entity-framework-with-ironpython.html

re: Some comments about comments and other ramblings about Project Jasper

rogerj — Sat, 12 May 2007 19:47:00 GMT

secretGeek,

My understanding is that Blinq is based on LINQ for SQL (it uses SqlMetal.exe), not the Entity Framework.

Not much has been hear about Blinq since it's mid-2006 release as a prototype that used the May 2006 LINQ CTP. It appears from the Blinq forum that the prototype hasn't been updated for Orcas Beta 1's LINQ implementation.

--rj

re: Some comments about comments and other ramblings about Project Jasper

lb — Sun, 13 May 2007 14:33:18 GMT

okay -- i've just researched this a little further.

So it seems that blinq is from the ASP.net team while Jasper is from the ADO.net team. Different beginning but a common goal. (I had wrongly assumed that Jasper was a rewrite of Blinq).

A nice paragraph tying the two together is written here:

http://pather.net/shyam/ViewPost.aspx?PostId=7

(under the heading -- "ASP.NET Dynamic Data Controls")

cheers

re: Some comments about comments and other ramblings about Project Jasper

aconrad — Tue, 15 May 2007 03:28:49 GMT

A few answers to the questions in the prior comments …

Jasper being a Sql Server only framework is just a limitation of the first CTP. If you look at the Jasper download package, we install private copies of System.Data.dll and System.Data.Entity.dll (renamed for the CTP) because we required some Entity Framework functionality not available in the Beta 1 Orcas down load. As a result, because of the ADO.net provider factory design and the fact we didn’t want to mess with config files – we decided to hard code Sql Client as the only provider for the initial CTP. This was a hard decision, but we wanted to get the preview out the door. And since Sql Express is free – we could at least give folks a chance to play around with Jasper. In house we actually have had Jasper working over some of the non-Sql Server Entity Framework providers and even over Access and DataSets. Non-Sql Server provider support is very high on our list for CTP2.

Also of note, Katmai (next version of Sql Server) for the Entity Framework is a ship vehicle not a restriction on what providers are supported. Astoria and Jasper are currently very early in the product cycle (still in incubation) but I don’t see any reason why these technologies would only support Sql Server.

The blinq project has actually morphed into a project called “Dynamic Data Controls for ASP.NET” (http://www.asp.net/downloads/futures/) which is part of the latest Microsoft ASP.NET futures CTP. Polita was one on the main designers and developers of that project, and is also part of the Jasper design team. Going forward we are looking at integrating Dynamic Data Controls for ASP.NET WITH Jasper if this looks appealing to anyone.

Cheers - Andy

re: Some comments about comments and other ramblings about Project Jasper

rogerj — Wed, 23 May 2007 22:35:38 GMT

Integrating Dynamic Data Controls with Jasper appeals to me because BLINQ was based on LINQ to SQL. If BLINQ morphed to DDCs, this would indicate that the DDCs are based on LINQ to SQL, too. Assuming that Jasper becomes RDBMS-agnostic, it would provide RDBMS independence to the DDCs and, presumably, greater O/RM flexibility.

--rj

re: Some comments about comments and other ramblings about Project Jasper

Jacky Lee — Mon, 04 Jun 2007 07:20:51 GMT

When will Jasper Final be released? Anticipating~~~~

re: Some comments about comments and other ramblings about Project Jasper

aconrad — Mon, 04 Jun 2007 21:05:56 GMT

No RTM release plan yet. We are currently planning for another CTP release towards the end of the year.