Picking the First Programming Language

Picking Programming Languages for High School - Never Ending Story

Computer Science Teacher - Thoughts and Information from Alfred Thompson — Fri, 12 Jan 2007 13:52:18 GMT

I see that Susan Canaga is bringing her school's discussion on programming languages looking for industry

Ученье - свет

Items — Mon, 30 Oct 2006 18:31:17 GMT

Наткнулся тут на интересные посты по поводу обучения computer science .(Смотри ссылки раз , два и три

re: Picking the First Programming Language

Peter Rock — Sun, 29 Oct 2006 15:58:30 GMT

Hi Alfred,

I felt my response to your question to be deserving of its own post. You can find it here...

http://gnuosphere.blogspot.com/2006/10/response-to-alfred-thompso_116212950756269678.html

Thanks,

Peter.

A Reply to an Interesting Comment - More on a first programming language

Computer Science Teacher - Thoughts and Information from Alfred Thompson — Fri, 27 Oct 2006 13:13:54 GMT

Tom Hoffman wrote a long and very interesting reply to my previous post for which I am very grateful.

re: Picking the First Programming Language

Alfred Thompson — Fri, 27 Oct 2006 12:58:12 GMT

Well Peter, why do you avoid teaching students how to use any proprietary language or user-level application? How is that relevant to the concepts you are teaching or any other educational goal?

re: Picking the First Programming Language

Peter Rock — Fri, 27 Oct 2006 10:04:27 GMT

Alfred says:

"<i>Another completely irrelevant argument is over avoiding proprietary languages.</i>"

This is disturbing. It is, of course, disturbing in and of itself, but even more so that - as a teacher - you make this claim.

As Tom stated, you have not presented this argument well at all. Personally, I do what I can to avoid teaching students how to use any proprietary languages or user-level applications. I would like to know how you reason that my choice is "irrelevant".

re: Picking the First Programming Language

Tom Hoffman — Fri, 27 Oct 2006 00:28:06 GMT

Whoops. I'm on crack. I meant "Hi Alfred," not "Hi Bill."

re: Picking the First Programming Language

Tom Hoffman — Fri, 27 Oct 2006 00:26:39 GMT

Hi Bill,

You don't do a very good job of either presenting or refuting the arguments for using free software programming languages.

First off, there is nothing wrong with an educator using free software for philosophical reasons. Teachers often make decisions for philosophical reasons. I'd be frightened to trust my kid with someone who didn't.

Now, what do you get with a free software license?

1) the freedom to use the language for any purpose.

For schools, the most important part here may be that this right doesn't expire. You don't have to renew the license, you can't be forced into paying for an upgrade. This isn't a limited educational version, you can use it to write and deploy any kind of application you want.

2) the freedom to study how the language works and adapt it to your needs.

Is this of practical value to 90% of the kids in an intro class? Probably not. Is it of value to teachers who really want to understand what they're teaching and kids who are fired up about programming? I think it is. Good programmers learn a lot by reading well written code. You can read and learn from code that would be too complex for you to write, or understand completely.

But beyond that, yeah, this is a philosophical issue. I believe that computer science is a science, and I can't imagine being in another science class, like biology or physics, where a student would be told, say, "Well, as a matter of fact, mitochondria do have their own RNA, but I can't tell you why, because that is a trade secret." We should value engagement and drilling deeply into issues, without running into black boxes and proprietary code.

3) the freedom to redistribute copies.

This is very important for schools. The language isn't limited to specific computers in the school. It can be installed at home by students. They can install it on their friends computers and show their friends how to program.

4) the freedom to improve the program, and to redistribute your changes.

Maybe not a big deal on the local level, but globally, it means that derivatives can be created that may suit local or educational needs better than the generic version.

Also, cross-platform compatibility does not always accompany free software, but it often does, and it is important for keeping schools' options open for their OS platform, and it ensures that students can use the software at home.

re: Picking the First Programming Language

Anthony Tarlano — Thu, 26 Oct 2006 22:22:49 GMT

I would pick the Python programming language. Additionally, I would use this free online book by a high school CompSci teacher in Fairfax, Va to teach the course.

http://www.greenteapress.com/thinkpython/

Picking the First Programming Language

Daniel Shapiro's WebLog — Thu, 26 Oct 2006 22:17:45 GMT

Great post by Alfred Thompson . We encounter this discussion all the time. Educators look to Microsoft