Why does copying a file to my USB thumb drive say that the parameter is incorrect?

re: Why does copying a file to my USB thumb drive say that the parameter is incorrect?

Someone — Mon, 17 Oct 2011 09:34:30 GMT

@Evan: I found a better explanation here: msdn.microsoft.com/.../ee240893%28v=VS.85%29.aspx. "When a commit occurs, TxF first flushes all undo information, then flushes the actual file changes, and then writes and flushes a commit record." etc etc

So yes, TxF not only provides isolation of ongoing modifications but also ensures the persistence of commits.

"Forcing a flush from a GUI standpoint on *removable file system* is NOT a bad idea." I also think so because this would perform better than doing all operations with a disabled write cache.

re: Why does copying a file to my USB thumb drive say that the parameter is incorrect?

Klimax — Sun, 16 Oct 2011 06:43:40 GMT

@foo.bar:

What bug? Error in error message? (passing internal error)

re: Why does copying a file to my USB thumb drive say that the parameter is incorrect?

foo.bar — Sat, 15 Oct 2011 21:40:52 GMT

A bug the Windows team never bothered to fix

re: Why does copying a file to my USB thumb drive say that the parameter is incorrect?

640k — Sat, 15 Oct 2011 14:06:48 GMT

Forcing a flush from a GUI standpoint on *removable file system* is NOT a bad idea.

re: Why does copying a file to my USB thumb drive say that the parameter is incorrect?

Evan — Sat, 15 Oct 2011 11:21:47 GMT

@Someone: If NTFS transactions *don't* flush to disk (or at least have that as an option), I would view that as a major problem. Maybe I'm too much in a database mindset, but to me, "transaction" (at least in the context of disk operations) means ACID. If you lack a flush you don't even really get isolation, because if it crashes in the middle than a process that starts after the restart isn't isolated from the intermediate changes; for this among other reasons, IMO transactions without ACID buy very little. (Exception: the OS says "transaction committed!" but it is not flushed to disk. A crash happens. The state of the system after boot is in the pre-transaction state. This isn't ideal, but it's pretty good as long as if you want durability, you can stick a flush inside your txn.)

Fortunately, msdn.microsoft.com/.../cc163388.aspx indicates that it's ACID: "When I say transacted file operations, I am talking about transactions with fully ACID semantics".

re: Why does copying a file to my USB thumb drive say that the parameter is incorrect?

Anonymous — Fri, 14 Oct 2011 21:59:23 GMT

Can't send mail to user: not a typewriter

re: Why does copying a file to my USB thumb drive say that the parameter is incorrect?

Someone — Fri, 14 Oct 2011 08:48:49 GMT

@Gabe: I'm not sure if 640k is talking about the fact that NTFS is a journaling file system since it was invented (which only protects metadata), or about the transactional support added with Vista that allows commit/rollback of file operations like a database. (I would not consider something introduced in Vista as being existent "for many years".)

I'm also not sure, if committing a transactional file operations really means that all data related to that operations (metadata and filedata) are flushed to disks during the commit. I see this file transactions only as a form of isolation: Other processes will see the transacted changes all at once, or never, but no intermediate changes.

re: Why does copying a file to my USB thumb drive say that the parameter is incorrect?

alegr1 — Thu, 13 Oct 2011 23:33:11 GMT

"It finished writing the last byte. As far as the file copy is concerned, it's done. (Forcing a flush is in general a bad idea.) -Raymond"

In Vista+,if you copy a large file to a USB drive, and want to cancel operation, you may have to wait for long time. Because it's in overlapped mode, not cached, and has enormous amount of pending write IOs which are not cancelable. It doesn't need flush. Don't remember if Win7SP1 has it fixed.

But in older OSes, when the lazy write was used, it was making total sense to limit amount of dirty data for 1 seconds of writes worth, or so.

re: Why does copying a file to my USB thumb drive say that the parameter is incorrect?

Gabe — Thu, 13 Oct 2011 23:06:29 GMT

640k: Transactions in NTFS are optional; they have to be initiated by the application. Even so, transactions ensure that data is not corrupt, not missing. In other words, the data will all be there (committed) or all missing (rolled back).

re: Why does copying a file to my USB thumb drive say that the parameter is incorrect?

640k — Thu, 13 Oct 2011 22:42:14 GMT

ntfs has been a transactional file system for many years. Not a single byte should be corrupt or missing, it should be foolproof.

Wby does the copy dialog disappear (or indicate operation finished) before a copy operation is flushed on a removable file system?

[It finished writing the last byte. As far as the file copy is concerned, it's done. (Forcing a flush is in general a bad idea.) -Raymond]