Need help

re: Need help

AT — Sun, 20 Mar 2005 11:16:00 GMT

I would like to share a link to original Cyrus report at Product Feedback:
"Add support for covariant return types in C#"
http://lab.msdn.microsoft.com/ProductFeedback/ViewFeedback.aspx?FeedbackID=FDBK22976

As well past discussions about this at http://blogs.msdn.com/cyrusn/archive/2004/12/08/278661.aspx

We really need your votes. Derived classes must be able to freely change/enforce additional contracts. But this feature must be done carefully to not cause harm for/by non-covariant languages (discussed in comments at posting from 2004/12/08).
This is not that easy as it appear - but doable.

re: Need help

Hasani — Sun, 20 Mar 2005 17:01:00 GMT

I'm all for covariant returns but why would someone not want covariant returns? What are the drawbacks, if any?

re: Need help

Cyrus Najmabadi — Sun, 20 Mar 2005 19:47:00 GMT

Hasani: Just the cost to add support for them.

Plus, possibly a higher learning curve for new developers.

Regardless, i think the benefits far outweigh the costs.

Did you vote? :)

Go Vote!

Jesse Squire's Weblog — Tue, 22 Mar 2005 18:48:00 GMT

Go Vote!

Jesse Squire's Weblog — Tue, 22 Mar 2005 18:48:00 GMT

re: Need help

Hasani — Wed, 23 Mar 2005 16:42:00 GMT

the runtime doesn't currently support covariant return types. Adding
them is something we're considering for the future.

-Eric Gunnerson circa 2001

possibly a higher learning curve for new developers.
>> are you kidding me? Maybe that person is developing with the wrong language then.

Just the cost to add support for them
>> umm? How much would it cost. I'm sure the value of the result of adding covariant returns will outweigh the cost. .net has been in the works since the late 90s, no one complained about the cost of migrating from com to .net.

Regardless, i think the benefits far outweigh the costs.
>> agreed

Did you vote? :)
>> HELLZ YEA!

re: Need help

Cyrus Najmabadi — Wed, 23 Mar 2005 19:51:00 GMT

Hasani: It would probably cost quite a bit. You'd need to update the C# language spec. Which means taking this stuff to ECMA and getting it approved (not an easy process). You'd also need to implement it in the runtime as well as every language out there. Because you were changing the CLS you have the potential to break every other 3rd party tool that integrates with the .NET world, etc. etc.

If it's just a low benefit: i.e. "slightly better API construction and consumption" then it's not clear that such a large cost would be worth it.

Note: i'm just putting some perspective on it. Obviously i want it too :)

re: Need help

AT — Wed, 23 Mar 2005 20:54:00 GMT

I've found a strong reason for this feature. Other that your AST tree.

IEnumerator<T> and IEnumerator (as well IEnumerable<T> and IEnumerable).

Currently Microsoft offering is lame. We have to use two methods - one of them is one liner - but still mandatory :-((

re: Need help

Hasani — Thu, 24 Mar 2005 00:44:00 GMT

Well my friend, was this not thought of during the early days of the .net revolition? I mean, I'm sure every developer at Microsoft has ventured in c++ at one point in their lives, which allows covariant returns. Why is this feature being discussed so late in the game. I'm sure this issue must have been brought up internally some time last century.

re: Need help

Cyrus Najmabadi — Thu, 24 Mar 2005 00:47:00 GMT

Hasani: I've given you some reasons for why it was not necessarily included. And I dont' consider this "late in the game". I'm brining this up so when we do planning for post VS2005 we consider this.

Would you prefer we not have this in the future?

re: Need help

Hasani — Thu, 24 Mar 2005 07:06:00 GMT

I'm all for covariant returns, it's just that I doubt it will ever happen =(

Covariance on return types - on the feature list for C# vNext?

notgartner.com: Mitch Denny's Blog — Fri, 25 Mar 2005 12:12:00 GMT

re: Need help

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ff

ff — Fri, 26 Aug 2005 19:57:22 GMT

https://blogs.msdn.com/msg.aspx?MessageID=17

re: Need help

ff — Fri, 26 Aug 2005 19:59:18 GMT

re: Need help

ff — Fri, 26 Aug 2005 20:00:39 GMT