Accessibility in Windows 7

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Domenico — Mon, 01 Dec 2008 09:54:17 GMT

Nice post!!

We are increasingly excited

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Meph — Mon, 01 Dec 2008 12:35:51 GMT

It's great that Microsoft have been working hard to fix all of the problems in Windows. They've made a great new operating system that's going to make life great for all end-users. Well done!

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

AssistiveTech — Mon, 01 Dec 2008 17:31:23 GMT

This I look forward to -- in my job I work with (almost!) every blind and low vision assistive program out there. Having Windows 7 contain usable basic assistive products would be a godsend for my clients who don't need the full power of the commercial programs. MacOS has done very well with their magnifier, and you can use LINUX Compiz to very good effect as a full screen option. Kudos on not abandoning assitive tech!

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Domenico — Mon, 01 Dec 2008 18:58:46 GMT

@AssistiveTech

The maghifer of Windows 7 6801 is the BEST!!!!

right Windows+ or Windows - keyboard

VERY AWESOME!!!!!

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

screwballl — Mon, 01 Dec 2008 23:53:02 GMT

There needs to be a way to make each of these items modular.

No one in my family nor myself has any need for any of the options available for the deaf, blind or otherwise incapacitated.

So allowing this to be a modular addition is a strong desire of the community.

A simple spot in the Control Panel, as well as the option during the Windows installation itself. Something like this as you are installing Windows or as an OEM product, when Windows is started up the first time, not some buried "custom install" menu buried under 30 clicks:

"Windows 7 allows for increased functionality for people with disabilities including the deaf, blind as well as other handicaps. Do you want to install the Accessibility Module?

1) Yes, install everything

2) Yes, install but keep it inactive for later use"

3) No, do not install"

(but allow this to be installed at a later time from the installation media or downloaded).

This will not only allow minimalists to keep a slimmed down Windows install but also keep the option available in the future if the computer is sold or something happens to the person.

***Important***

I would suggest and prefer each and every portion of Windows, including those mentioned in these blogs such as the taskbar and everything else to be modular, this way we can use a minimalist install on an AthlonXP or netbook system and the full blown install on a 8 core 4GHz Intel i7 (future) CPU.

Otherwise XP support will need to continue through 2014 and linux will continue to make gains (not like thats a bad thing as it is already happening)...

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Domenico — Tue, 02 Dec 2008 01:03:14 GMT

@screwballl

See here

http://channel9.msdn.com/forums/Coffeehouse/443119-windows-7--MinWin/?CommentID=445902

Default accesibility keyboard shortcuts

JohnCB — Tue, 02 Dec 2008 02:53:11 GMT

I know I'm going to be stoned to death for even just mentioning this, but I think the default shortcuts for keyboard accessibility aren't well thought-out.

The shortcuts I'm talking about are Sticky Key's five-times-shift, and Filter Key's shift-for-8-seconds. Toggle Keys' num-lock-for-5-seconds is much less likely to be invoked accidentally, likewise Mouse Keys is almost impossible to trigger accidentally.

This could be solved by avoiding to use common keys for the shortcuts, like I mentioned above the ones using num-lock are mostly safe from accidental invocations. You could have a single shortcut that pops up a window with all 4 keyboard accessibility features with big toggles (both clickable and keyboard-selectable), this way it's also easier to remember since you reduce the number of shortcuts to one.

Just a thought.

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

someone — Tue, 02 Dec 2008 06:33:23 GMT

1. While speech was a major advancement, I feel Vista took large steps away from accessibility for normal people by making it difficult to do tasks by requiring more keystrokes and more mouseclicks than ever. At so many places in the UI (e.g. Default Programs), there is only one way of navigation, either the mouse or the keyboard but not both. Lots of 'tabbing' is required if using the keyboard.

2. What features does Windows have for customers who are color-blind? The ability to output a grayscale display would be nice. Is is technically possible on a color monitor?

3. It would be awesome if the Windows 7 accessories were made available on at least Windows Vista.

4. How about the ability to pin/temporarily stick the magnifier lens to the desktop when right-clicked so it only temporarily doesn't follow the mouse?

5. A better voice than Anna, why not license a cool one from partners such as NeoSpeech?

6. I too agree the keyboard shortcuts for sticky, filter, toggle keys need to be changed, first thing I do when I install Windows is turn off the shortcuts to prevent accidentally triggering accessibility features.

7. For FilterKeys, why are users limited to fixed predefined repeat rates in seconds? Why is it not possible to type in any value for seconds?

8. Correct me if I am wrong but AFAIK, the MouseKeys feature is impossible to use on some laptops because they don't have a numeric keypad.

9. Windows' keyboard layout viewer/IMEs should be universally accessible/have keyboard shortcuts. MS should also update Character Map to make inserting special character easier and update it to support the OpenType font typography features.

10. The new onscreen keyboard seems to have lost the numeric keypad, the ability to customize font and whether to keep it always on top.

I hope all these are addressed.

other thoughts

tryon — Tue, 02 Dec 2008 07:56:28 GMT

Here are my thoughts on acessibility (a "legally-blind" person talking, with a very low vision):

- Remember the Zoom'S setting in IE according to the url and/or a setting, if for example I want all my msdn webpages to be zoomed at 125% with a "full page zoom" (versus text zoom) it should be zoomed automaticly each time the browser starts and remember the type of zoom.

- Make higher-DPI available in a per-application basis. Not all legacy aplication respond well to high-dpi, but I still love it and would like to use it wherever I can (and as the population gets older, more and more people will love that feature which should be made even more acessible on each program setting). It should be possible to run a programe twice, with low and high dpi, because some part of an application may respond well to high-dpi and others not.

- When using high-dpi, I've encountered many pop-up error messages where I can't read the whole error message (the end of the sentences are simply "cut"), you could certainly do something about it in the way windows handles api...

I really love the fact that microsoft is taking acessibility seriously.

PS: I've dicussed this in the windows 7 taskbar comments, but I thought this might be a better place.

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

csm120 — Tue, 02 Dec 2008 12:56:21 GMT

I would really love to see some thought given to accessibility when in safe mode, or while repairing/reinstalling Windows. I am a blind computer users, and it is frustrating to either create an answer file, or get help to repair/reinstall windows, or to just use safe mode. Perhaps some audio support for safe mode at least?

Thanks for any thoughts you may have alon these lines, and I appreciate what you are doing within windows itself to make it more accessible.

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

GRiNSER — Tue, 02 Dec 2008 18:13:54 GMT

Didn't have the chance to already use any Win 7 Builds so I don't know this: Is there a Windows + Scroll Wheel option alike the Ctrl + Scroll Wheel on OS X for the magnifier? This is really handy because you don't have to move your hand away of the mouse to use the magnifier shortcuts on the keyboard.

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

tryon — Tue, 02 Dec 2008 20:58:39 GMT

@csm120> It would be nice to have some high-dpi or audio support when booting into safe mode indeed.

The problem is when you're pressing F8 and choosing in which mode to start, it is the motherboard constructor who manage that, my friend has a motherboard that talks to him through the whole boot process or when error popup, that's really great even for me because I can check other thing without having to wait on the screen for the next "message/error"

@GRiNSER> As far as I can see there is no such thing, that is a really important feature that is missing. Maybe there is some obscure shortcut but it isn't showed in the properties menu, which should be easily visible and customizable.

All the acessibility option should be available as custom shortcut as I don't want them "on" all the time and I hate the navigation in the new start menu, it's simply aweful (can't find the old one, which is way less "click", it works with hover only).

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

martinmine — Wed, 03 Dec 2008 00:54:56 GMT

This looks even better and better!

One of the functions that I am excited about, is the speech recognition program. But the minus with this function is that it is with Windows ass default, and therefore, it uses a lot of diskspace. When you install Windows, you should have been asked if you want to install some of these functions.

But in the future, I can see us wring on a "paper" that is connected to the PC, and the PC recognize the letters we are writing on the paper. A familiar function is in the Windows 7 build 6801. If I had a touchscreen, I had used this function a lot, like when i write an essay.

But you guys in Redmond are doing a great progress on Windows 7, and keep doing it! But, please do not go in the same trap as you did with Windows Longhorn that the half OS was too complex, and the release date where placed many years after the release date you tough the Longhorn platform was finished.

Keep up the good work!

Martin

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

marypcb — Wed, 03 Dec 2008 03:30:21 GMT

There's the usual conflict of priorities to ponder with the shortcuts - whether to make them memorable/easy to guess or make them easy to use. I can't press Winkey-+ with one hand and I'd like it to be a one-hand shortcut. But nothing is ever going to be as discoverable and memorable as Winkey-+ for zooming in.

I'm thinking the next rainy afternoon I get bored, I shall try cycling through the Winkey and the rest of the keyboard, because I only know 9 Winkey shortcuts (+,-,E,R,P,S,D,F,L) and I bet there's a few more...

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

locolorenzo — Wed, 03 Dec 2008 04:51:50 GMT

I just am so excited about what has be and will be the most progressive and user friendly OS that is on the Market!

Thanks for all the hard work.

I discovered these features to be just great, I use when without reading glasses, I also really have to give the thumbs up to the font/display tuning for ease of use for older user such as my self!

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

anonymuos — Thu, 04 Dec 2008 13:07:48 GMT

Can you make the 5 key of the numeric keypad (which currently sort of simulates a left mouse click) behave exactly like the left mouse click like the button we have on laptops? For example, it is currently not possible to drag or hold the 5 key down and simulate a drag or hold. Also, there is no real key for right click (though most keyboards have a context menu key however that really brings up the context menu where the keyboard focus indicator is, not where the mouse pointer/cursor is).

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Domenico — Thu, 04 Dec 2008 14:16:41 GMT

PS.

Windows 7 Beta is coming for Developer !!!

http://www.msdndevcon.com/Pages/start.aspx

WOOOWW!!

OPS!! Im Not Developers :(

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

bluefisch200 — Fri, 05 Dec 2008 11:24:52 GMT

@Domenico

And also at January 13 for you others...

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Domenico — Fri, 05 Dec 2008 16:05:16 GMT

@bluefisch200

I saw the article Ed Bott where he hopes the Beta for 13 January,

I have also seen that $ 99 can sign up to receive the DVD

http://blogs.msdn.com/bobfamiliar/archive/2008/12/02/windows-7-beta-1-for-mdc-attendees.aspx

If it were possible from Sign from Italy to receive the DVD in Italy (although im not developers)

would i immediately register.

I can not resist

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Eghost — Fri, 05 Dec 2008 20:12:01 GMT

What I would like to see is Microsoft address one of the major complaints from the Beta's Vista, the ability to move and edit the tool bars, address bars, icon bars, menu bar. For the life of me I can't not understand why Microsoft still puts up a wall when it come to this small aspect of the UI. It was and is still a major complaint by many, Microsoft ignored it in the beta's of Vista and still to this day has continued to ignore this simple and modest request. Come on Windows Seven team, stop locking down the UI, is really that difficult to add a few lines of code back in to Windows? Will it really hurt the operating system to allow users a choice? It such a simple request, Windows Seven team, Why can't you do it????? so disappointing, so very very disappointing....

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

burgesjl — Fri, 05 Dec 2008 20:29:59 GMT

I'll assume you've carefully thought through all of the implications of UI Automation. Sounds to me like a potential avenue for malware to exploit this API.

I'm not a user that needs this functionality, but I see it as very important for MS to think really hard about this. If you can make it easier for someone with a limitation, its going to make it easier for all the rest of us as well. I understand the desire to have multi-key press activation of commands (Win + X key), but surely this has to be very difficult for people with limited hand dexterity or only a single usable digit. This may also be a problem with multi-touch on touch screens. Maybe some thought needs to be given to gesture-type interfaces (I've seen some stuff with cameras that follow hand movements), as well as the speech interface. Thinking about how these things might be used, even if the functionality isn't there built into the OS, may lead you to some new ideas.

Please make sure you have as many physically-challenged users as possible on your usability review teams. I'm constantly surprised by the enterprising and innovative ways people have of overcoming their limitations, and finding a way to get stuff done. They come up with ideas that us able-bodied folks don't and for good reason they're passionate about it.

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

blargsoup — Sat, 06 Dec 2008 06:38:47 GMT

@Eghost

I think removing the ability to totally customize the toolbars in explorer was done on purpose. It makes it easier to support the software if you know someone hasn't hidden or squished the address and search bars down to nothing. You might just want to suggest what icon you need to be quickly accessible.

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

marcinw — Sun, 07 Dec 2008 01:38:27 GMT

I still don't see any valuable information about new system on this forum + I have found some new articles (like "Windows 7: Simple vs. Easy" and "Microsoft exec: Windows 7 is no service pack"). I decided to comment all these facts on my page: http://www.gammu.org/wiki/index.php?title=HydePark:Thinking_about_Windows_7

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Domenico — Sun, 07 Dec 2008 01:46:49 GMT

@marcinw

Pls stop your SPAM!!

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

marcinw — Sun, 07 Dec 2008 01:56:33 GMT

@Domenico,

You're commenting for example fact, that testing beta of Windows 7 costs 100$ now and I'm commenting some other facts.

If you think, that my last post was spam, I can start writing comments again directly on this forum.

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

bluefisch200 — Sun, 07 Dec 2008 02:16:34 GMT

@marcinw

I dont think that your posts will help anything...wy not just say...i hate you, Microsoft...every post of you, in your wiki, is about how bad Vista, maybe the best OS on Earth, and 7 are, and that XP is the only good OS...do you know wy everyone likes XP...7 Years of working with the OS, and not becouse its easy...

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Eghost — Sun, 07 Dec 2008 04:01:31 GMT

@blargsoup

I actually want to be able to squish and change tool bars around, by the way I never have had to call support.:) It's just options and choice. I remember this was a major complaint in the Betas of Vista, and again its really a minor request, but it's a suggestion for Microsoft, I would love to see them allow access to the tool bars, icon bars menu bars, address bars it is the reason why I don't use Vista on a regular basis, and for many it's a major flaw in Vista, I just hate to see history repeat itself.

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Eghost — Sun, 07 Dec 2008 04:13:07 GMT

@bluefisch200

Actually Vista has not been well received,

"7 Years of working with the OS, and not becouse its easy..."

I actually find XP a lot more intuitive than Vista. Almost every major complaint about Vista was major complaints in the betas of Vista, Microsoft ignored them,that was a mistake.

I think saying sums it up.

"Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it."

--George Santayana

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

marcinw — Sun, 07 Dec 2008 12:34:13 GMT

@bluefisch200,

Vista hasn't been received well by market, because system has got some disadvantages. This is not only my opinion.

Microsoft starts to repeat some mistakes from Vista in Windows 7 and I'm writing about it and only about it (in my opinion system can be wrong received by market, if development will be done like now). Microsoft need to change some rules and go into some other direction - if they will say "we have excellent Vista codebase" only, they will fail again. As Eghost said it would be good to return to history:

there were Windows 98 SE and NT 4.0 quite good received by the market. Microsoft proposed Windows ME, which wasn't excellent. They had seen it and resigned from it. Concentrated on successful NT 4.0 and we had 2000, XP, etc.

now there was XP very good received by people. Microsoft proposed Vista, which isn't excellent. They don't resign from its' solutions, but say: we know better, what market need. And we will give something looking and working similar. And I'm writing about it.

I don't say, that I hate Microsoft - there are many nice and hard working there people and they're making very good job there (for example with Visual Studio). I know, that Steven is making his job as good as he can. But some decisions (decisions, not people) are wrong and I'm writing about it.

Windows 7 will be maybe received a little better, because our computers are better (faster). But it can be failure too. If you think, that's different, please show concrete technical reasons. Not marketing words about excellent taskbar or touch screen support. I'm really opened for discussion and I'm waiting for it.

As Eghost said similar critic comments were ignored in beta stage of Vista. Will be good for Microsoft to ignore them now ? We will see.

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Domenico — Sun, 07 Dec 2008 12:48:52 GMT

@marcinw

NO!Beta is TOTAL FREE!!!!

I wanted to pay $ 99 only for a DVD collector.

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Vistaline — Sun, 07 Dec 2008 20:02:24 GMT

>>Vista hasn't been received well by market, because system has got some disadvantages.

...which have absolutely nothing to do with accessibility.

-----

I'm not particularly blind but I make regular use out of 6801's screen magnification, it works but text reproduction at some (most) levels of magnification is horrid. At 125% (and many other levels) some lines of text look slightly compressed (making them slightly difficult to read), have rainbow edges, and are otherwise in dire need of anti-aliasing. These effect sometimes make text somewhat harder to read zoomed. And giving me headaches, I think, which was plenty of reason for me to sadly put it down. DirectWrite and Direct2D are coming in the beta, I assume. Is it safe to also assume they will aid magnification? And will the magnification tool move to tracking the mouse rather than having to be dragged by moving to the edge of the screen? Dragging the view from the edge of the screen feels unnatural and I find it to be imprecise (not too big a deal) and difficult to use.

And how will Windows 7 handle high-contrast mode and magnification? As things currently stand it's impossible to use the new magnification tool with high-contrast because WDM isn't running. The new magnification tool has to be used with Aero, which I imagine is bad for people that required high-contrast.

And a suggestion: map magnification to Win+Scroll Wheel as well as the keyboard, using slightly smaller incriments to better utilize smooth scrolling on some mouse wheels.

And, of course, I should again mention these are the opinions of a person with no real _necessity_ for the tools. My eyesite is terrible but I can see with my trusty-dusty glasses, these just help.

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Eghost — Mon, 08 Dec 2008 06:44:46 GMT

@Vistaline

>>Vista hasn't been received well by market, because system has got some disadvantages.

...which have absolutely nothing to do with accessibility.

it has actually everything to do with accessibility, that type of blanket denial is what happened in the beta's of Vista. Vistaline were you part of the Vista betas? I know I was. All Microsoft could say was no, go over to IE 8's blog, all Microsoft is saying is no. Microsoft is really not open to suggestions, and for the life of me I can't figure out why. There are many reasons why Vista has failed, but first and foremost is, they dismissed user feed back as just reluctance to change, that they knew better. Microsoft lost, the industry lost, they need to learn from their mistakes, they need to listen even if it is not what they want or the majority wants. What it comes down to is options, Microsoft need to stop dictating. They need to understand that just because they think it's a great idea, doesn't make it so. "Life with out Walls" is not just a marketing ploy, its a philosophy that Microsoft needs.

"Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it."

--George Santayana

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

AssistiveTech — Mon, 08 Dec 2008 18:12:52 GMT

Does the full screen magnification work like the commercial products (ZoomText, ZoomWare and MAGic)? In other words, does it transparently magnify the screen so that your cursor still operates icons and applications as if the magnification was not there?

I am looking forward to obtaining the beta - and I do not get to go to CES or the developers conferences :( and trying out the features. I have clients who just need basic screenreading and magnification in their lives, NOT the full power (yet) of the commercial products.

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Domenico — Wed, 10 Dec 2008 12:39:06 GMT

Team is in Holiday?

Pls new thread :D

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

bluefisch200 — Wed, 10 Dec 2008 21:54:32 GMT

@AssistiveTech

Yes like its how you look just on a little part of the screen...

@Domenico

Also waiting^^

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

FireRx — Thu, 11 Dec 2008 18:41:40 GMT

Hey Folks,

Product is great. However I found an issue that should be addressed before beta1 gets released to the masses. Don't know if anybody tried to innstall the latest build in a dual boot situation with Windows Vista, but there is a boot screen malfunction. The "Animated" bootscreen that everyone is "ga-ga" to get in beta 1, is in conflict with Vista's Boot manager. It seems to go to the default bootscreen instead of the new animated one. I was diappointed when it didn't work for me. Now imagine me x 100,000. I tried all kinds of thing including deleting the bootmanager, and installing windows 7 bootmanager. Still no love! Aanyways, please pass this to the proper channels to fix .

This occus on both x86, an x64 platforms.

Thanks,

FireRx

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Domenico — Thu, 11 Dec 2008 23:43:27 GMT

@FireRx

Hey you have a bad dump from VHD , wait Beta.

@ Team Windows

Remember this Beta will pass into the hands of journalists bad who will try in every way to create negative reviews

PLS Unleash Hell.

- Domenico

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

bluefisch200 — Thu, 11 Dec 2008 23:48:18 GMT

I saw @ WinHEC that if you hover the mouse over a live preview, you see the window in full size. Wy dont add this feature to the [Alt] - [TAB] window switching?

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

bluefisch200 — Thu, 11 Dec 2008 23:52:37 GMT

+ If i have a window minimized in Vista and also in PreBeta of 7(6801) the live preview do not update and you see always the old preview. I hope you will change that for the Beta...

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Domenico — Fri, 12 Dec 2008 00:03:12 GMT

@bluefisch200

You wont Update PrePreBeta? Noo :D

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

PsironTech — Fri, 12 Dec 2008 22:21:53 GMT

Still using 6801. Some minor issues, but still a darn sight better than Vista was (not a hard goal to achieve, mind..)

I am hoping the problems of Vista are gone now that you guys have changed the dev process. It seems to be working so far.

Keep it up guys... and get on with the next post already! :D

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Domenico — Fri, 12 Dec 2008 23:22:39 GMT

@PsironTech

were is a problem in Vista?

Fud or problem?

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

BogdanPopa — Sat, 13 Dec 2008 18:42:55 GMT

No problem in Vista if you know how to manage. i think W7 is much more productiv and more easy to work with it.

so i belive problems in Vista is fud.

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

PsironTech — Sun, 14 Dec 2008 23:50:36 GMT

@Domenico:

Personal experience?

Wireless resets, inconsistent USB file transfer speeds, incredibly slow UI response time, slow boot, slow shutdown, power management not functioning properly - no sleep/hibernate).

It's a far sight better than it was pre SP1, but it's no-where near stable on any of my personal systems. Both of them fare much better on XP or Win7 (though Win7 seems to still have issues with USB at this point).

Drivers have gotten much better. It's _almost_ usable now, but what's the point? Especially since it looks like a July 1 RTM for Win7.

No FUD. Just personal experience. I can put XP or Win7 on either of the two laptops and have a quick, responsive, stable system. Putting Vista on them ... Not so much.

Really, the wireless issues are the worst though. Sure, it could be my router+Vista=problems, but since the router works flawlessly with XP and Win7, why fight it?

@BogdanPopo:

If it works for you, great! But don't tell me I don't know how to manage my systems just because it works for you/not me. Talk about ego tripping... I've been doing Enterprise IT for 12 years now. We're skipping Vista (though had it looked like Win7 would have been delayed anywhere near as much as Vista, we'd have gone to it for the security benefits alone and made due with the other issues).

@ devs:

Keep up the good work, guys. Can't wait for Beta 1!

The New Windows Task Bar

snaven — Mon, 15 Dec 2008 18:35:45 GMT

I just took a look on the Task Bar in 6956. It looked a kinda nice, but you've done some terrible mistakes there.

Where is the "Network" shortcut in the Start Menu??? I use all the time. I need it!!!

It's very annoying that the Internet shortcut no longer are in the Start Menu (exept "all programs").

Also I would like to have the Run command available.

Please listen to this. You should not make to many differences in Windows 7. Good Luck! Can't wait to get a Beta key to Windows 7!

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Domenico — Mon, 15 Dec 2008 19:46:31 GMT

Ok ,

indeed the team is on "vacation" :-)

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to ALL!!

-Domenico

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

tryon — Tue, 16 Dec 2008 00:04:30 GMT

snavenÀ You can edit your whole start menu yourself, although some change could be made to improve the UI used to do this I managed to get mine with a lots of shortcuts that are very useful, here is a screenshot: http://img213.imageshack.us/my.php?image=33195172se4.jpg

bluefisch200> Totally agree, Aeropeek should be use too for alt-tab windowsswitching, I hate the mouse.

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

pverhoe — Wed, 14 Jan 2009 10:31:35 GMT

Hi,

Since 1998 I'm the editor of magnifiers.org and the community there is exited about full-screen magnification in Windows 7 as mentioned in this Blog.

But in the latest beta, there is no screen magnifier with full-screen and lens mode at all!

Only the help files are suggesting, that there is a screen magnifier with full-screen and lenz mode, but the magnifier itself does not support this features?

Peter Verhoeven

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

ShakaUVM — Mon, 19 Jan 2009 01:29:05 GMT

The worst part of accessibility in Vista is navigating around through directories. You used to be able to use the arrow keys, return, and backspace to navigate around arbitrarily through the folder structure. Now backspace is "back" which breaks this behavior when working through shortcuts, and choosing an arbitrary folder above to click on is slow and tedious. The old up-arrow button (which does something) was replaced by a "refresh" button which does nothing, and placed in a prime spot of screen real-estate.

Get rid of the damn green button, and bring back up-arrow.

What about Narrator? - re: Accessibility in Windows 7

RCC2k9 — Wed, 21 Jan 2009 07:16:50 GMT

Here are some comments on Windows 7 accessibility, now that I've had a chance to try the beta (build 7000). I'll keep them in two separate posts for coherence.

1. Narrator: A lot has been said about changes to the OnScreen Keyboard and Magnifier, but Narrator is being neglected - and it's in need of some serious help. Back in Windows XP, even better in Windows 2000, Narrator was quite useful for its purpose. Then Vista came and Narrator took a huge downgrade. Despite the nicer voice of Microsoft Anna, Narrator in Vista is noticeably less responsive than Narrator on Windows 2000 or XP, and it isn't Anna adding the extra weight. I've tested Narrator in Vista with other speech engines, including the open source eSpeak, which is extremely responsive, except in Narrator. No matter what speech engine you use, Narrator takes forever to read menu lists or items as you move with the arrow keys, making browsing through lists unbearable. Not to mention the extra time it takes to announce "Down arrow", which is extremely annoying - maybe that's why respectable screen readers like JAWS or WindowEyes don't announce arrow keys and stick with announcing what control or list item you have landed, which is what you really want to hear. Please, please, PLEASE make Narrator in Windows 7 responsible and usable again, as it was in Windows 2000 or XP!

On a separate, but not totally unrelated note, I also agree that a Safe Mode option with basic sound support is really needed so blind users can troubleshoot their own systems.

New Magnifier misses the point - re: Accessibility in Windows 7

RCC2k9 — Wed, 21 Jan 2009 07:26:43 GMT

After commenting on Narrator, here is my second comment on Accessibility in Windows 7 beta build 7000.

The Magnifier. It was nice to see Microsoft's Magnifier enlarging in full screen mode; this is something that should've happened back in Windows 98 or Windows 2000 at the very least. But the Magnifier in Windows 7 really misses the point.

1. Tracking UI controls and typing focus is annoying. That "smooth scroll" effect leads to some violent screen jumps that can make you dizzy.

2. The new Magnifier only works with Aero enabled. Why??? Although disabling Aero is yet another gripe I'll discuss in the next post, the truth is that once you start a full-feature screen reader, Aero gets automatically disabled. Kiss goodbye to the idea of using the Windows 7 Magnifier together with a screen reader such as WindowEyes or JAWS; you get the old-fashioned Vista magnifier instead. The only way to use MS Magnifier is if it is the only accessibility tool used. (Well, it works with Narrator, but Narrator really doesn't work - see my previous post.)

Themes - re: Accessibility in Windows 7

RCC2k9 — Wed, 21 Jan 2009 07:38:47 GMT

This is the last one of these posts, I promise, until things change for either better or for worse.

Themes: Unless you can survive with the built-in accessibility tools, your theme options are extremely limited. Back in Vista, Microsoft designed the system so that when a mirror driver (used by full-featured AT tools) is loaded, Aero goes away and you are downgraded to the extremely depressing and hard-to-use Vista Basic theme. From all the themes I've ever seen used in any OS, Vista Basic has to be the worst of the worst, not only in how ugly it is but also in the extremely poor contrast it has - you can hardly see when a menu item is highlighted, for example. Some of you might think "oh, blind people don't care about the theme." That's like saying a blind person doesn't have to dress fly or look good. While it's true appearance is not in most blind people's priorities, it isn't necessarily out of their list. I'll give you that one though, but remember, low-vision users can see the Vista Basic theme (just renamed "Windows 7 Basic" now) and suffer with the ugly it is and the low-contrast it provides.

What are our options? According to Microsoft, just switch back to the way outdated Windows 95-ish themes. I think Microsoft should've designed their accessibility so other AT programs can work with Aero. Or at the very least, provide updated themes options that are more usable and visually-appealing than the "basic" theme that replaces Aero when you need to use a fully-feature screen magnifier and/or reader.

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

handtomouth — Mon, 26 Jan 2009 01:45:19 GMT

For those of us who navigate by keyboard and voice, the search box in the start menu is a NUISANCE. I can't just press the Windows key+a letter, or say an item; I have to get the focus out of the search box first. It is clumsy and tedious. Have an option to turn the thing off, PLEASE!

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

thoeg — Fri, 06 Feb 2009 07:42:04 GMT

Hi,

I am a blind user using jAWS for windows, and very soon I am going to test out windows 7 64 bit with JFW 64 bit. there are some hardware issues I have to resolve, and a friend has to burn the dvd first, since the only dvd writer I have is on the new computer that has no OS installed.

So since to my knowledge there is no way for me to install windows 7 without sighted assistance, nno way of using a script or any other silent installation, I will have to both find a screen, and a sighted person who is willing to use 30 to 60 minutes I hope before Narator or JAWS is up and running.

I am sure that many blind users like me is frustrated over this serious lack of accessability! especially when users of voiceover the screen reader for mac has all the advanced possibility. voiceover can be started on any mac running 10.4 or later, no special installation. Voiceover can both do roleback and an OS reinstall something no screen reader, narator, or JAWS or any other windows screen reader is able to do. I understand that the scope of the accessability features also in windows 7 is limitted seen from a blind users perspective compared to mac users, so a way to do installs without sighted help is for me at least very very important. yes it is nice that 7 runs faster even on slow hardware, and all the visual changes are of no practical use, so I think many blind users will look at important practical features like beeing able to manage the system or help on frends computers without sighted help!

claus

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

Yalin — Fri, 13 Mar 2009 06:24:45 GMT

Hi,

About Magnifier in Window 7, I am wondering if I can run it with some CMD

command like "Magnify.exe -lens/fullscreen -somerate"?

re: Accessibility in Windows 7

tabela — Tue, 10 Nov 2009 13:40:53 GMT

since I used msdos, I have been using windows products. I was interested in eachimprovement of windows. but I cant say samethig

for windows 7 . I cant adopt windows 7.