Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

SimpleScript!!!

mattd — Thu, 27 May 2004 19:16:00 GMT

Off topic but...
Give us more SimpleScript!!! No Pressure
Also could you integrate into ATL Server=)

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

Eric Lippert — Thu, 27 May 2004 19:16:00 GMT

I'm still working on it little by little, but I don't have much time to spend on it lately. We've got to ship Visual Studio at some point here you know...

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

secretGeek — Fri, 28 May 2004 03:10:00 GMT

That's brilliant Eric.

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

Muhammad Ali Shah — Fri, 28 May 2004 05:55:00 GMT

Quite a captivating way of explaining things! Thanks!

.Net Remoting explained bizarely

Wackylabs — Fri, 28 May 2004 11:45:00 GMT

This Eric Lippert guy is quite funny sometimes, go check out his explanation of the difference between MarshalByRef and Serializable. Made me laugh, and I understood it too.. Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects...

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

Tom Trenka — Fri, 28 May 2004 15:03:00 GMT

This is simply brilliant. Do you have any idea of how many times I've tried to explain the concept of serialization to those who don't know, only to fall flat on my face? BRILLIANT.

(of course, coming from "the Man", I suppose that's what I should have expected :)

I for one would love to hear more on this topic (as well as the JScript.NET is Serializable); SimpleScript is interesting, but this is a bit more practical ;)

Do you have a link to the book you've mentioned?

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

Peter Torr — Fri, 28 May 2004 15:55:00 GMT

I hope that when you insert the disk into the Molecular Neuron Refrobnicator you get a nice "The memories you are about to implant could be those of an axe-murderer. Are you sure you want to continue?"-type popup.

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

Muhammad Ali Shah — Fri, 28 May 2004 18:47:00 GMT

Could be, "....axe-murderer. Are you sure you don't have an axe nearby?"

Or something like, "This sytem has been thoroughly tested in the usability labs but we take no liabilities, implied or otherwise, of the results."

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

Dan Shappir — Sat, 29 May 2004 21:41:00 GMT

The only problem I have with this otherwise good analogy is that it makes marshal-by-value seem more complicated than marshal-by-ref. While in the physical world this is often true (it can be very difficult to build and send an exact duplicate of some object) in the virtual world it's often the reverse.

Anyway "The only parameter passing mechanism endorsed by Real Programmers is call-by-value-return, as implemented in the IBM/370 Fortran G and H compilers"

http://www.pbm.com/~lindahl/real.programmers.html

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

Virag — Sun, 30 May 2004 12:57:00 GMT

An excellent analogy how did you come up with it?

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

Eric Lippert — Sun, 30 May 2004 15:42:00 GMT

Beats me. What am I, a neuroscientist? Maybe read "Fluid Analogies" by Douglas Hofstadter if you want to understand how people come up with analogies.

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

sotto — Sun, 30 May 2004 19:47:00 GMT

Thanks, this was fun to read... and interesting.

sotto’s dev[b]log » Remoting - Marshal By Ref vs Marshal By Value

TrackBack — Sun, 30 May 2004 22:50:00 GMT

sotto’s dev[b]log » Remoting - Marshal By Ref vs Marshal By Value

New and Notable 58

Sam Gentile's Blog — Tue, 01 Jun 2004 18:55:00 GMT

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

Haluk — Fri, 30 Jul 2004 06:59:00 GMT

Can a class have the [Serializable] attribute and be derived from MarshalByRef?

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

Eric Lippert — Fri, 30 Jul 2004 07:02:00 GMT

Can a clone take a phone call?

Sure, why not?

A great and funny way to explain object serialization Vs Marshal by Ref!!

zhen206 — Mon, 06 Sep 2004 18:03:00 GMT

TrackBack From:http://www.cnblogs.com/leecs1/archive/2004/09/06/40457.aspx

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

Radhika — Wed, 26 Apr 2006 09:42:43 GMT

Man...that was some explanation...really Awesome!!!

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

Tanveer Badar — Thu, 17 May 2007 15:53:52 GMT

Wasn't that movie "The sixth day"?

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

Geek At Your Service — Fri, 30 Nov 2007 10:59:21 GMT

A fantastic show of writing hard-to-crack technical thing to a read-to-laugh-and-never-forget topic.

Eric, you are great!

The Geek!

geekays@gmail.com

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

/\/\asoud — Sun, 09 Dec 2007 08:54:49 GMT

Hi Eric

It was very simple, clear and useful story!

thanks

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

Justizin — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 21:36:39 GMT

Just a note on terminology and us crazy Python folks with 'pickle': pickle is not a slang term, it's a protocol, so please do not confuse things by referring to [Serializable] or Marshal-By-Ref or anything as pickling and unpickling. I am working on a pickle module in IL which might be an alternative means of serialization, though more likely a compatibility solution for existing Python apps, and for interop with Python apps.

As for terminology of .NET serialization, I like frobnicate / defrobnicate..

Speaking of Python, and Molecular Neuron Frobnicators, anyone interested in this should check out Perspective Broker, originally of the Twisted project, but afaik now ported to many platform and languages. If there isn't a PB implementation on .NET yet, there sure oughta be.

I always said - use real-world examples!

I always said - use real-world examples! — Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:01:04 GMT

PingBack from http://cafe.themarker.com/view.php?t=495233

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

Sriram — Tue, 24 Jun 2008 20:10:26 GMT

I couldn't have understood this better.. amazing !!!

Using a Separate Application Domain to Test for Implemented Interfaces

Colby Africa — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 18:51:28 GMT

Sometimes you need to load an assembly for use or inspection.  The problem is that loading an assembly

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

deelipfan — Thu, 15 Jan 2009 01:19:39 GMT

"In keeping with our ridiculous analogy" - are you kidding ?? Your analogy told me a million things. I didn't even have to read the rest of your article and went back to what I was doing after I read the two scenarios.

Please...please....include analogies like these in future while explaining concepts at a high level. Saves a lot of time for us.

I was wondering if you could explain the concept of signing assemblies (public/private key concept) with a real life analogy.

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

SandyRaikar — Thu, 23 Jul 2009 09:38:43 GMT

awesome analogies... cannot be erased forever

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

TheCPUWizard — Fri, 24 Jul 2009 02:09:30 GMT

I am continually suprised that "professional" developers don't understand this. "By Value" and "By Reference" are basic concepts that exist in almost every language (VB, C++, etc.) and are the inherent decision point in .NET when deciding if you declare a class or a struct......

You are either working with the original (single) object or you are working with a copy (there can be many).

Yet as soon at his moves into "communications" environments (even between AppDomains), then people seem to forget (or ignore) all of the basics........

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

zorex — Fri, 16 Oct 2009 16:32:38 GMT

Amazin article !!

Could any one explain in which case we would need MarshalByRef model across netword ?

Thanks

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

zorex — Fri, 16 Oct 2009 16:32:52 GMT

Amazin article !!

Could any one explain in which case we would need MarshalByRef model across network ?

Thanks

re: Marshal-by-ref versus Serializable Objects

TheCPUWizard — Fri, 16 Oct 2009 16:45:31 GMT

Zorex, you are (effectively) using MarshalByRef anytime you use a SOAP webservice!

Consider a simple "Vote" class:

class Vote

{

void VoteForA();

void VoidForB()

int AVotes();

int BVotes();

}

There is ONE instance of this class on the server.

If you Marshal by value, place a vote and then look at the counts, you will see 1 and 0 (just your vote) - simply because you are looking at YOUR copy.

If you Marhal by Reference, place a SINGLE vote and then look at the counts, you will se the results of EVERYONE who have voted.