The install needs work - the download site isn't reliable and it crashes (reported) after the download fails.

The concept is great though.

First of all... the express range is excellent. I've only played around with teh C# and Web Dev express products but they are excellent. I'm really looking forward to getting "down and dirty" with the .NET Framework 2.

As regards getting started with the products.. the C# Express install seemed to stall when it was completed. I had to end the process to exit the install... when I did everything worked properly but I think this could have been an issue on my side.

I haven't had a chance to chek out any of the starter kits yet but I will have a look at them this evening, after work.

Please, put up a feature matrix that compares Express with the normal versions. Or can you point me to some place where I can read what the Express versions are lacking compared with the Professional versions? That is sort of the one single information I'm interested but I can't find it anywhere...

Congratulations Paul! I'm really looking forward to trying these out.

Have a great time there in Europe and come back and see us in the Toronto Area soon!

In Australia, we typically pay by the megabyte for downloads. So software which needs to download itself on each PC is no good.

I'm scared to try because failed downloads cost us money. Would it be possible for Microsoft to provide downloadable versions of the software?

Downloading hundreds of megabytes via http or ftp is OK, as long as resume works. But an integrated downloader per install means we can't use it.

It's not just Australia that downloads mean money, broadband in many of the developing nations has limits on the size of downloads. If you're targetting a worldwide market, an alternative to a smart download should definition be available.

While I can see why you have a smart download app, you can also perhaps trust some of your intelligent users with that decision - such allowing the user to choose between a smart download, one with the .NET framework, one with the compiler etc. I know it's more work, but when the goal of the project is to expand its user base, you can't afford oversights like these.

My humble 2 cents.

I downloaded the Express, Web Developer, with J#, SQL Server 2005 and MSDN Help Files. Everything was up and running in minutes (after install). I had my first web page running in about 3 minutes...

I can't wait to dig in deeper!

Ditto David's comments - I've read over and over how much the Express versions can do... but what can they not do, compared to the Standard, Professional, or Enterprise editions?

> How easy was it to get started with Express?

Very easy, although it would be nice to have a stand-alone download without the download manager (ie/ to show it to friends or burn it to a CD).

> What features were most helpful or cool?

The formatting options are awesome! The spacing options, bracket placement options, all A++! The only thing that didn't appear to work was the "Format Document" option. I purposely mangled the text formatting of the document yet it didn't reformat it based on my options.

> What features weren't so helpful or
> were lame?

Where did the "InitializeComponent" implementation go? I'm assuming that thats why the form's are now partial classes - the compiler generates the code for you.

One problem, however, is that occasionally you get a nasty property or something that injects itself into InitializeComponent's implementation and there is no way to get it out other than editing that method to delete it.

This is more of a complaint with all VS versions, but I really hate the "default events" (ie/ double click to create event). It never fails that when I'm reorganizing my form, I will double click and have nasty empty events everywhere that I need to manually clean up!

> What inspired you to check out Express?
> What is your programming background?

I would consider myself an "advanced" developer - I have programmed basic, pascal, VB, delphi, C, C++, C#, Java.. At the company where I work I am the an application architect / lead programmer.

I downloaded Express for three reasons:
* SQL Server Express is replacing MSDN, and the product we are launching uses MSDN.
* I work on hobby projects after work and I wanted to see if VS Express would work for what I want to do (and not be too limited, as is often the case).
* Our company is still waiting for our MSDN welcome kit, and I wanted to see some of the new features in VS and .NET .0

> Did you find the content to be too
> advanced, too easy, or just about
> right for your level?

The fact that it comes with the MSDN documentation means that it had everything I need - I'm more of an advanced developer so I found it just right. I really like the fact you added "Learning to program" information - very nice! I wish I had that information ages ago... :P

> What other starter kits or content would
> you love to see?

A managed direct-x project would be great :-) ( as well as MSDN-style documentation )

This isn't really a content-related suggestion, but I would love to have a CVS plugin for it. There are many web-communities that only supports CVS and it would help expand interest in .NET to other areas.

I just downloaded and installed VB .NET Express. Installation went almost as smooth as a baby's butt, but had an anoying error message in the end. This didn't surprise me though, I was installing with very little HD space left on my C: drive. For some reason it looked like the installer didn't got passed copying file 34989, but continued anyway...

As far as using VB .NET Express, I worked without trouble. Although I'm a total n00b on programming (I have some (read: a little) experience writing VBScript/ASP) I managed to follow and create 'My First Program'. A very basic exercise and very nice to start with.

Since it's still Beta 1 I can't expect a perfect product. I know I will use the help functions a lot, though a lot has to be documented in the future. When I've used some for a little while, I'll comment again.

The DVD Collection Starter Kit is just perfect. It's enough to see what's possible and 'buggy' enough to get you trying to improve the thing (it'll make an exception when you remove *all* DVD entries, also the empty ones).

After all, the first impression is a good one. Thank you for even thinking about VS Express :-)

This is a very smart move for Microsoft and a non programmer who has always had inspirations to play around the Express editions show me that you all have been thinking about all of us so called nonprofesionals.

Beautiful timing, just as I was scouring the net for a free/cheap top quality C++ IDE ...

I'd consider myself a intermediate programmer on average.

Just one small thing, why does everything have to be part of a project? I'd love to be able to just open a .c/.cpp file i've worked on previously in another editor, and compile and run straight away. Rather than have to create a project...

Ah well, I'll stop complaining, i'm really very happy, honest!

"Visual C# screen saver"

Any chance you guys will port it to VB? When I was beta testing VS.NET 2002 I wrote a screen saver in VB. It's mostly functional as far as drawing goes but I never bothered to add all the features to make it a screen saver instead of a winform app. Every time I see a sample screensaver it's in C or C# (this goes back to the VB5/6 days).

I'd love to see Windows Screen Saver show up as a project template since there's a ton of code that's the same for every screen saver.

Steve: That sounds like a great programming project to help you learn about C# :-)

Of course, I'm biased...

I looked for the QuickStarts, I ran the Personal Website, but couldn't find the Walkthrough in the documentation. I know this is FREE and BETA, but why list the QuickStart page and have nothing there? Even a friendly note would be nice. PS When is someone going to update the Look and Feel of the ASP.NET website, it is starting to look dated.

The error reporting function of the Web Express version has been crashing (hanging) I let it sit for 30 minutes, nothing happened.

It's great hearing from so many of you already!

Setup issues: I just posted something specific to track this. Our team looking at this issue closely in Redmond, and we'll update you.

DVD starter kit: So can I claim that I put those bugs in there for you on purpose? Thanks for the kind and funny response.

Screen saver: this thing rocks. I'm thinking very seriously about getting the VB version put together. Do others think this would be cool? It would be good to know in general when you like a starter kit, so we'll know to add it to our plans. Also, if somebody here wants to do the initial port and post it, you'll probably be a hero ;)

Quickstarts: Omar what do you think?

Bugs: don't forget to post bugs on the MSDN Product Feedback Center.

Quickstarts are at: http://beta.asp.net/quickstart/

Sorry about that, the forwarding link is not right on the VWD Express product page.

PS - www.asp.net will get an overhaul soon.

Shadow Chaser:

"The formatting options are awesome! The spacing options, bracket placement options, all A++! The only thing that didn't appear to work was the "Format Document" option. I purposely mangled the text formatting of the document yet it didn't reformat it based on my options."

The formatting engine won't format into any blocks that have parse errors in them. Things tend to get way too screwed up when you try to do that.

The formatting engine also won't remove new-lines except in very special cases. There is reasoning behind this and Kevin blogs.msdn.com/KevinPilchBisson can tell you more

"Where did the "InitializeComponent" implementation go? I'm assuming that thats why the form's are now partial classes - the compiler generates the code for you.

One problem, however, is that occasionally you get a nasty property or something that injects itself into InitializeComponent's implementation and there is no way to get it out other than editing that method to delete it. "

You can get to InitializeComponent in two ways. one is by right-clicking on the call in the constructor and saying "goto defintion", the other is by going into the solution explorer and clicking on an icon that says "show all files" You can then expand the form icon to show the .cs partial file that it uses to dump initialize component into

> What features weren't so helpful or
> were lame?

* The lack of an interface for a SCM: even a lightweight IDE requires (at least should) some sort SCM integration, especially in the case of the target of the Express product line.
* No Starter Kit for VC++: For someone who never had the pleasure to work with VS it can be hard to get into it without any ready-to-be-explore project right after the install.
* No "legacy" resource editor. But as neither ATL and MFC are included, this is acceptable :)

> What inspired you to check out Express?

Being curious about C++/CLI was the reason to try VC++ Express.

> What is your programming background?

C/C++ on windows for some years now. Experiences in other languages and platforms, so I would call myself an advanced programmer :)

> What other starter kits or content would you
> love to see?

A starter kit for VC++ (as explained above). No idea about content :)

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