Protected Mode in Vista IE7

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Nick Presta — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 03:00:30 GMT

Sounds good. I am glad security has been taken into such great consideration.

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Spikey206 — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 03:47:13 GMT

This doesn't particularly adress one main area of security concerns. That being, as useful as the new "Use *** as your new Search" feature is, End Users will more often than not accept, and that's *still* script execution that could, and most likely will, be manipulated.

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Xepol — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 03:56:11 GMT

Is there a way to prevent third party apps from forging "Elevation Opt-In Lists for CreateProcess" entries in the registry?

Otherwise, it is all for naught. One trojan will just open holes for the rest.

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

dude — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 04:02:49 GMT

firefox 1.6

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

dchan1936 — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 04:18:15 GMT

I don't see much difference from Firefox other than it is a Microsoft product

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Petknep — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 04:20:33 GMT

The registry entries will most likely be set to high integrity so they will be difficult to write to. For a process to run at high integrity, you would need to opt in at the elevation dialog. Any security loophole would leave code executing at hopefully low integrity and at worst medium integrity, still unable to mess with the registry entry.

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

mocax — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 04:43:13 GMT

GUI version of the "sudo" command in *nixes?

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Peter — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 05:05:06 GMT

How will this affect Web info managers like Onfolio, ContentSaver, or NetSnippets? These programs save contents from IE into database files, which can be located anywhere the user specified during installation.

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

EricLaw [MSFT] — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 06:13:43 GMT

@Xepol: "One trojan will just open holes for the rest."

The point is to prevent you from getting the first trojan in the first place, since Low Integrity processes cannot write to the list. If a bad guy has a trojan on your system, he doesn't need to attack IE anymore. He can just use his trojan.

@dchan1936: "I don't see much difference from Firefox other than it is a Microsoft product"

Current versions of Firefox do not offer Protected Mode style features. Any bug in Firefox that allows for code execution permits the code to execute with the user's permissions.

@Peter: "How will this affect Web info managers"

In general, the web info managers' files will be virtualized into the the virtual folder system. Alternatively, the extensibility could be coded to use a custom broker to save data in the original location.

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Ron — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 10:01:40 GMT

I tested my pages in IE 7 beta 2 preview as the IE team requested and discovered that conditional comments don't work correctly in IE7 or IE6.

Please open this page in IE to see what I mean: http://rowanw.com/tests/conditional_comments_broke.htm

IE7 only displays half the data it should, while IE6 doesn't return anything. I have used the <comment> tag, because I've used it on a live page combined with conditional comments to make something work in IE6. That particular page doesn't render in IE7.

So have a look at my example page and tell me I made a mistake. I used two separate windows machines with diffierent versions of IE to test this.

broken link

wks — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 11:31:17 GMT

The "User Account Control White Paper" link doesn't work....

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Lordmike — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 11:32:41 GMT

@Ron--
Nothing shows in IE6 for me.

I get this is FF 1.5.0.1
This should be visible only in IE 7 or 5
end of ie 6 comment
This should be visible only in IE 6 or 5
end of ie 7 comment

I'm not a webdeveloper, but shouldn't this work in ff as people always try to tell me that ff follows all the standards (which I find hard to believe)?

My guess is that I should only see one of the texts in IE6 and one of the texts in ff or both.. I dunno. :-)

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Ron — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 11:39:46 GMT

Lordmike, the <comment> tag is not part of the recommendation by W3, it's IE propietary HTML. That's why any browser except IE will ignore that tag.

Maybe it should be removed from IE7 to make my life easier?

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Lordmike — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 12:23:20 GMT

@Ron--
Aha ok!
It should be removed completely if it's not part of W3C recommendation.
Why I think this is because if IE use it too much, then W3C will one day make one of its own and calling it something else and will then render <comment> non-standard completely.
They have done this before... or so I've read on this blogg.

What else can you use to do what you want?

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Ron — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 12:33:50 GMT

Firefox, Opera, Safari, Konquerer, even IE7, but working between IE6 and IE7 will prove to be difficult.

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Ravi — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 15:53:05 GMT

is it better than mozilla firefox? if so, in what way?

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

H.Y — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 16:00:27 GMT

It might be good to make the translation function installed in TOOL.

E-Mail h-h-a-y@mvd.biglobe.ne.jp

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Lordmike — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 16:04:55 GMT

@Ravi--
Well FF wont work in protected mode, only IE will work that way. Meaning IE will be more secure on Vista then any other browser.

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Santosj — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 18:18:32 GMT

Well, I was wondering a few weeks back when I heard of the protected mode and I was wondering if any other software applications can place themselves in Protected Mode also? As a sort of, kind of software developer in C++, I was wondering if I could create a program that didn't need all kinds of access and could use the sandbox (protected mode) while connecting to the Internet to protect the user from themselves and protect the user from my program because I don't have a lot of security experience.

I also ask because it would be something that Opera or Mozilla may want to take advantage of when Vista comes out. I don't know how Mozilla would take advantage of the new systems, but they could probably be working on it, doubt it as I haven't heard anything and the tools for Vista have been out for quite a while. Could be on Bugzilla but I rarely check that.

I should also note that I didn't read the above whitepapers as I'm tired (which isn't a good excuse, I'm just lazy).

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

curious — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 18:46:54 GMT

@EricLaw [MSFT]
"Current versions of Firefox do not offer Protected Mode style features. Any bug in Firefox that allows for code execution permits the code to execute with the user's permissions."

That is also true for current versions of IE. I assume It will also be true for IE7 on Windows XP.

So is Protected mode a Vista feature or an IE feature?

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Andrew Eberhard — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 19:24:33 GMT

"The compatibility layers should allow most legacy add-ons to just work without requiring any modification."

This seems like a dangerous attitude. It seems to me (and this isn't meant to be rude) that you've assumed you can plug all the possible holes with your three pronged approach but that barring the rules imposed by those specific changes, ActiveX still runs pretty much the same as always. It seems to me that a keyboard recorder or an annoying control that launches dozens of new IE windows (in the same process) would still run just fine. Maybe the approach shouldn't be tilted as heavily toward keeping current software running in this case.

Lastly, I have to ask you if you honestly believe webmail newbie grandparents or a child desperately trying to download a game all his friends have would know or care about access levels. In the case of the former, they'll probably just type in their password (if indeed one's required) without understanding the dialog at all. In the case of the latter, if clicking ok is all that’s required, consider it done.

In these cases, it's tempting to say that fault for the infection would lie with the users themselves, but that's just an excuse for software that overestimates user’s familiarity with the technical underpinnings of IE. Please consider reducing functionality where ActiveX controls are concerned rather than merely adding more dialogs to the user experience.

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Greg — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 22:42:34 GMT

@EricLaw
Re: "Current versions of Firefox do not offer Protected Mode style features. Any bug in Firefox that allows for code execution permits the code to execute with the user's permissions."

This is true, however there are a few differences.
1.) Firefox may be running on multiple OS's therefore, attempting to look in "Program Files" on a Mac, or Linux would be pointless.
2.) No VBScript in Firefox
3.) No ActiveX in Firefox*
4.) Limited range of hacking opportunities since JavaScript doesn't support any MS JScript "extensions"
5.) No "significant" integration into other applications. E.g. not embedded in Windows Media player. Its very strange how all the free funny video clips around the net (and, yeah, the adult ones too) all seem to need to download a CODEC, that requires opening up a website. This one is particularly disturbing, since it can call a *specific* browser! (e.g. even if Firefox or Opera is listed as my default browser, it's "scary^H^H^H^H^interesting" how it can open up an Internet Explorer window.

@Lordmike:
I believe the answer to that, is time will tell. I would like to believe that this will be the Fort Knox version of IE, but I think that users may foil themselves on that. (E.g. when a typical user now, enters a site, that the "information bar" pops down, I often see them blindly clicking it, because it shows up for harmless javascript. They understand, that it is there, for their protection, but JavaScript is a significant requirement for basic functionality of many sites.)

Also of note, I pressume in Vista, that if a user has "low rights", but has had Firefox installed for them to use, that *some* of the benifits are passed onto Firefox, Opera and the like, simply because windows is more secure.***

*Yes, i am aware, if the user has installed an extention to override this, they have dealt their own cards.

***Note, if I'm mistaken here, in the Windows Vista approach to get users to run as users, not admin, and to get software to "run" in a secure fashion, then please advise. As it stands at the moment, I'm "admin" on every box I touch, out of necesity (sorry, done the low rights thing in 9x,NT,XP,2K3, and it ain't pretty)

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Rob Franco [MSFT] — Sat, 11 Feb 2006 03:37:33 GMT

@curious

Protected Mode is only available on Windows Vista because it depends on the new privilege restrictions in Windows Vista called Mandatory Integrity Control.

@Greg

I agree with you that reducing complexity can help improve security. As you may already, in addition to running IE in Protected mode, we're also disabling most of the ActiveX controls on your system from begin used by Internet sites and removing some legacy features all together. We’re doing that while still maintaining compatibility with the scenarios that customers use today. You can read more about those features in at the end of the IE7 release notes: http://msdn.microsoft.com/ie/releasenotes/default.aspx

To your second question, all applications on Windows Vista will run with User permissions and therefore have some protection. Internet Explorer in Protected Mode runs with even less permission and therefore enhanced protection for your personal files and settings on your system.

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Dean Harding — Sat, 11 Feb 2006 05:23:51 GMT

What happens when you have one page in the Trusted Zone on one tab and another page in the Internet Zone on another tab? Since they're both running in the same IE process, how does that work?

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Sp — Sat, 11 Feb 2006 07:39:32 GMT

Why is it that no IE version thus far actually deletes history wwhen you tell it to? If you select to keep history for 1 day it will still show up one week from now.

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Sam — Sat, 11 Feb 2006 10:52:32 GMT

Dean: Pages in non-Protected Mode zones open in their own browser window.

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re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Mike — Mon, 13 Feb 2006 17:26:25 GMT

My goodness, I haven't seen so many acronyms since the last Sun Microsystems press release!

Geez... I can't imagine what it'd be like around the office. "Quick! The TIF must have UAC to the ACL with ACE and ensure the integrity of the UIPI!" :/

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

LeRoyK — Mon, 13 Feb 2006 19:50:29 GMT

My "browser helper" dll uses WriteFile() to a Mailslot. Will the user be asked for permission to do that? How often will the user be asked? Each write, or once for each instance of IE, or once for the first write by the helper.

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Simply Awesome — Tue, 14 Feb 2006 02:33:51 GMT

With all these benefits of "Protected Mode", why don't you set IE7 to run this way by default?

I am not convinced that novices would be confused if there were SIMPLE, BUT DETAILED explanations for errors, risks involvd for making exceptions, and how to avoid them in the future.

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

LarryOsterman — Wed, 15 Feb 2006 19:13:00 GMT

Simply Awesome, from what I've seen, it IS the default (on Vista).

If you're surfing in the internet zone, then you're running in protected mode (it says so in the status bar :))

re: Protected Mode in Vista IE7

Simply Awesome — Thu, 16 Feb 2006 01:31:26 GMT

LarryOsterman, gg; should have tested it on the beta Vista and not just on XP.

Glad Microsoft is as keen on security as I am.

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IE8 and IDN | Sarin.Mobi

IE8 and IDN | Sarin.Mobi — Wed, 09 Jul 2008 17:38:33 GMT

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vista security trojan internet explorer fix

vista security trojan internet explorer fix — Sun, 13 Jul 2008 01:11:50 GMT

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Using IELaunchURL to launch and retrieve the PID of a protected mode IE7 window - Jeff Wilcox

Fri, 26 Sep 2008 01:46:52 GMT

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Internet Explorer Plugins and Vista « Technical tidbits

Internet Explorer Plugins and Vista « Technical tidbits — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 11:15:10 GMT

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HTTPS New Window | keyongtech

HTTPS New Window | keyongtech — Sun, 18 Jan 2009 19:26:31 GMT

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tijdelijke internet bestanden | hilpers

tijdelijke internet bestanden | hilpers — Fri, 23 Jan 2009 15:50:30 GMT

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IE8 Security Part VIII: SmartScreen Filter Release Candidate Update | Techno Portal

Tue, 10 Feb 2009 09:14:35 GMT

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IE8 Security Part VIII: SmartScreen Filter Release Candidate Update | Chorr Blog

IE8 Security Part VIII: SmartScreen Filter Release Candidate Update | Chorr Blog — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 12:10:43 GMT

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IE8 Security Part VIII: SmartScreen Filter Release Candidate Update

Блог команды разработчиков Internet Explorer 8 — Wed, 18 Feb 2009 14:27:26 GMT

Изменения в фильтре SmartScreen в IE8 RC1 Привет, меня зовут Алекс Гловер (Alex Glover) и я являюсь главным

IE8 보안 5부 : 통합 보호

IE8 팀 블로그 — Tue, 17 Mar 2009 11:52:13 GMT

    안녕하세요! 저는 인터넷 익스플로러 보안 프로그램의 책임자인 에릭 로렌스라고 합니다. 지난 화요일, 딘(Dean)이 신뢰성 높은 브라우저 에 대한 저희의 생각을

Running as Limited User - the Easy Way

Hiu — Sun, 05 Apr 2009 20:22:24 GMT

Malwarehasgrowntoepidemicproportionsinthelastfewyears.Despiteapplyinglayeredsecurityp...

IEBlog Protected Mode in Vista IE7 | Paid Surveys

IEBlog Protected Mode in Vista IE7 | Paid Surveys — Sat, 30 May 2009 02:08:07 GMT

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IEBlog Protected Mode in Vista IE7 | Wood TV Stand

IEBlog Protected Mode in Vista IE7 | Wood TV Stand — Mon, 01 Jun 2009 02:21:38 GMT

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IEBlog Protected Mode in Vista IE7 | Insomnia Cure

IEBlog Protected Mode in Vista IE7 | Insomnia Cure — Tue, 09 Jun 2009 01:10:55 GMT

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