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Loneliness of the long-distance linguist.

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Languages, regions, locales, oh my!

Michael Kaplan has blogged quite a bit about our release of the Microsoft Locale Builder Beta, the final version of which is planned for use on Vista when it ships. We're pretty excited about the Locale Builder here for a whole bunch of reasons. Like The Microsoft Keyboard Layout Creator before it, the Locale Builder makes it possible for customers to create and share solutions faster and to ensure that the support available in Windows (support for formatting times, dates, currencies, and text, in the case of the Locale Builder) provides the best possible user experience across Windows applications. Straight up, you speak your language better than we do.

One of the pieces that I have been involved with since joining Microsoft is the investigation and maintainance of the NLS locale data that are used in Windows and .NET framework locales. Collecting data in an accurate, useful way poses many challenges. A whole array of things can impact language and technology standards in a region, including many factors whose rapid rate of change can make things interesting. Some things we need to keep in mind:

Changes in politics. Governments change at every scale. New leaders are elected; new representatives are appointed; new curricula are developed for school systems; official language legislation is passed and then revoked and then passed again.

Changes in standards. As technology evolves, new standards get created. As standards organizations change, new standards get created.

Changes in language or language use. Some languages are written in multiple writing systems. Vocabulary is created. A change in one part of the linguistic system can have ripple effects everywhere else in the system.

People move around. Just in my building, I work with native speakers of Spanish, French, Hebrew, Arabic, Chinese, Catalan, Hindi, Kannada, German, Portguese, Italian, Russian, Ukrainian, Japanese, Czech, Persian, and that's just off the top of my head. But they all work here, in Redmond. As people move around more and more, the usual pairings of language and region information inside a locale become less and less relevant. It's just not possible to predict the particular combinations that any individual user will want.

Even in a static universe, one size rarely fits all. I'm an en-US user, but I like a 24-hour clock. I'm weird like that.

The fact is that correct NLS data can be a moving target, and we're hoping that the Locale Builder can help address this for our customers. We're giving users the ability to change the locale data that we've shipped, not only for their own machines, but also for others, since they'll be able to share custom locales that they create. We're also giving users the ability to add new locales entirely, since we recognize that we provide just a small set of the possible languages and regions that our customers care about.

One thing I'm really interested in learning is which of these options will be more popular for our customers. Are people going to use the Locale Builder to modify existing Windows locales? In which case, which locales are people changing, and which pieces of data are they changing within those locales? Or are people going to use the tool to create new locales entirely? It's important to me that we understand what we're getting wrong today and what users feel that they need to fix.

Published Thursday, July 20, 2006 1:12 PM by KieranS

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# re: Languages, regions, locales, oh my! @ Friday, July 21, 2006 4:11 AM

Hi,

The locale builder is interesting but it doesn't appear to allow the creation of a new system locale.
I tried creating an it-IT locale (for Vista) based on English - in essence english strings but with the it-IT tag - but without luck.  Windows still thought it was english.

Dasher

# re: Languages, regions, locales, oh my! @ Friday, July 21, 2006 12:50 PM

What were you trying to accomplish? Did you just take the English locale and change the tag to it-IT?

Can you describe what behavior you were hoping to see, and what behavior you actually saw?

KieranS

# re: Languages, regions, locales, oh my! @ Friday, July 21, 2006 1:11 PM

Yes - I took the english locale and changed the tag.
I am working on a machanism for application translation where a non-localised application can appear as if it is localised via a helper tool.

Whatever I try Windows reports that it is en-GB or en-US rather that it-IT.

Dasher

# re: Languages, regions, locales, oh my! @ Friday, July 21, 2006 9:35 PM

So replacement locales -- which is what you are creating here, replacing the it-IT Windows locale with English data underneath it -- can be selected as system locales once they are installed. Supplementary locales do not have LCIDs, so they cannot be.

So in your scenario, your custom locale should be selectable as the system locale.

Take me through what you've done -- you've created the locale, you've installed it on your machine, you've selected it in Regional Options for Language for non-Unicode applications?

KieranS

# re: Languages, regions, locales, oh my! @ Saturday, August 12, 2006 8:58 PM

This is all well and good, but changing locales in Windows is pretty minor.

People ARE moving around more. Why not sell Microsoft software on individual user basis, in his or her choice of language?

It would be nice if I, as a native speaker of language X, could get a copy of Windows in my native language, even when I reside and work in another region, where language Y is spoken.

The solutions at present are poor:
1. international shipping - product may be impounded and will likely be assessed a heavy customs duty
2.  MUI versions - not available to individuals and carry a price premium (in any case, the hypothetical user wants one language, x, not the ability to switch between languages a through z on the fly, as the MUI provides)
3. return to native locale to purchase the product in person

I do not expect Microsoft to distribute 50 single-language versions of its products in each of its target markets. But what it could do is allow users to change the language of their software upon installation. Depending on the user's choice, the appropriate set of files would be downloaded from Microsoft servers and substituted for those on the install CD.

Given MS' large beta programs (Vista, Office 2007), this is technically possible. And you could tie this in with activation to thwart piracy (files would be bound to the machine.)

Francis

# re: Languages, regions, locales, oh my! @ Monday, August 14, 2006 1:08 AM

Thanks for raising this. I fully understand and appreciate your point. I think the Vista model makes some headway in addressing these concerns. Most customers installing from DVD will get some choice in the language they select when they install; not all MUI packs will be available on all DVDs, but we have put some care into bundling languages on DVDs such that most DVDs should cover more than just one kind of customer per market. If there is a particular language that you think there is a widespread need for that is hard to find in your market, definitely let me know.

KieranS

# re: Languages, regions, locales, oh my! @ Saturday, October 20, 2007 12:27 PM

I travel a lot and bought a laptop while in Denmark.  It has Windows Vista Home Premium on it and I've been trying all afternoon to get it to work in English, rather than Danish. Let me crash this little multicultural language party by saying it is far from obvious how to do this very basic thing.  Some comments I've seen on the web make it sound as if it is not possible without an Windows upgrade. I sincerely hope this is not true, else I'm going to suggest a little moderation in all this backslapping and self-congratuation is in order. Are they really holding me hostage to an upgrade befor they'll let me operate in English?

Robert Austin

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