Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management | Tmao Coders

Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management | Tmao Coders — Mon, 10 Nov 2008 18:33:26 GMT

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re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

tcmaster — Mon, 10 Nov 2008 23:31:47 GMT

really good features, congratulation after all these years you've finally made it. but wait, has any1 heard about a product named resharper?

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Chris Ortman — Mon, 10 Nov 2008 23:54:40 GMT

2nd tcmaster

Is this really a good use of time?

http://www.jetbrains.com/resharper

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

eclipseFan — Tue, 11 Nov 2008 08:03:26 GMT

Finally VS 2010 is playing catchup! I used to be a java developer and loved all the code centric refactoring features in Eclipse such as "Quick Search", call heirarchy and other refactoring features (all available as warly as 2006). More recently, I have moved to .NET and sorely miss all the features Eclipse offered. VS 2008 and even 2008 is, to be honest, really *lame* in these areas.

Glad to see Quick Search making it into VS 2010! I would really like to see other features like breadcrumb navigation, improved find all references etc baked into VS. VS 2010 still has a long way to go before it can catch up to Eclipse 2006, but I am glad MS is focussing on that. Kudos.

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Simon Buchan — Tue, 11 Nov 2008 09:18:45 GMT

So where does Quick Search fit in the heirachy of Ctrl+I, Ctrl+Shift+F, Ctrl+D, and Ctrl+F3? (Not counting all the object browser and other tools' finds!)

Also, I hope you can keep the startup and memory usage from degrading compared to previous versions with WPF, I've found (with older versions of WPF at least) the startup of WPF itself to be quite prohibitive.

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Simon Buchan — Tue, 11 Nov 2008 09:27:13 GMT

(Sorry for the double post...)

Also, any chance you could talk about C++ changes? For example, I remember statements about the compiler being refactored (rewritten?) so the IDE could use it to get much deeper, more accurate information. Any timeframe on C++0x features implementation, now the standard has a stable feature set? (SP1? VS 2012?)

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Somasegar — Tue, 11 Nov 2008 22:37:49 GMT

Hi Simon,

We are doing a number of interesting things with C++ in the VS 2010 product. I will talk about that sometime soon.

-somasegar

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Somasegar — Tue, 11 Nov 2008 22:42:34 GMT

I got a chance to talk to the channel9 folks the other day about this and more in terms of some of the things that we are building in VS 2010 and .NET FX 4.

You can check it out here: http://channel9.msdn.com/posts/VisualStudio/Soma-on-the-Key-Themes-for-Visual-Studio-2010/

-somasegar

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Robert — Wed, 12 Nov 2008 00:33:57 GMT

Many developers just accept the Visual Studio defaults, so please provide a better default font.

Concolas and Inconsolata are my favorites but 'anything' would be better than Courier New!

http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/archives/000969.html

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Ed — Wed, 12 Nov 2008 04:51:13 GMT

VS is my favorite _development_ app to use. But it will not be my favorite app overall until you take a real hard look at performance. VS 2008 is much better than 2005. But it is still a fat, slow, inefficient application that gobbles up memory worse than any other app (except IE7!) and given enough time can bring even new dev machines down to a crawl.

You need to get better here.

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Mark Gordon — Wed, 12 Nov 2008 04:57:46 GMT

Visual Studio “Inspiring Developer Delight” let's be real. I'm yet to hear anything about a data centric language (VFP) being included in the application or how about using a single source to create either winform or webform UI. The flaws of Visual Studio are embedded at the core of the bloated paradigm of the product, we do NOT want UI fluff. Do you really think developers are begging for a quick find dialogue? With so many things wrong with VS who comes up with these nonsense enhancements!

Let's move out of the arena of symbolism over substance and give us something that may actually put this in the same league as older technologies that worked and provide some "REAL" benefit to offset the high cost of ownership.

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Sam — Wed, 12 Nov 2008 06:50:40 GMT

Mark, I disagree with you. VS.NET is by far the best development product out there. Adding WPF enhancements to it will not only help developers work more efficiently but also keep them excited about working with a cool tool. Developers are human beings too, and they remain excited about cool UI as normal users do.

What older technologies are you referring to?

Soma, thanks for all the good work you and Microsoft are doing and don't be distracted by some comments that merely criticize. Constructive criticism and suggestions for improvement help. Like, how about providing a search in Visual Studio like Expression Blend 2? (Not aware if this exists via a 3rd party add-in)

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Adam — Wed, 12 Nov 2008 10:39:09 GMT

Hi Soma

Visual Studio 2010 looks great. I also agree Visual Studio is the best IDE out there and I must say I am loving Visual Studio 2008. These features are adding to an already great product.

And the MEF is a great concept. I was looking for something like this years ago, but like so many others developed my own plugin standard as there was nothing else out there.

Keep up the great work.

Visual Studio 2010 - código centrado en desarrollo y administración de laboratorio

Blog de Soma en español — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 08:36:27 GMT

Publicación del inglés original : Lunes, 10 de noviembre de 2008 7:18:00 AM PST por Somasegar He tratado

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Somasegar — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 10:14:11 GMT

Thanks Adam. Hopefully, you will find MEF to enable you to create plug-ins a lot more easily than ever before.

-somasegar

VSTS Lab Management is finally announced!

VSTS Lab Management team's blog — Fri, 14 Nov 2008 13:08:29 GMT

After more than a year that we have been working on Lab Management, we have announced the product last

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Tanveer Badar — Sat, 15 Nov 2008 13:05:39 GMT

I'll be the cynical here. VS editor is already slow enough when it is native code. Imagine what it will do when it is heavy weight WPF graphics!

I spend 12 hours of my life daily with badly designed classes (read 6K+ lines) and the editor hangs after typing a single token. I'll be staying out of VS2010's path for such projects.

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

ricom — Sun, 16 Nov 2008 21:27:35 GMT

Actually the graphics are not the problem at all. We've been shipping this editor earlier, you can see it in Blend. The old editor was full of problems that made big files very problematic. Several non-linear algorithms, or worse. We use "regions" for a variety of tracking things for instance (not just collapsing but errors, underlining, basically any annotation).

Those region management methods were quadratic, and they tended to have to adjust all regions, on-screen or not.

Worse, the old editor doesn't have a stable buffer model, so when we're trying to do background compiles for you, we have to copy the entire buffer (!) on every keystroke to give the compiler something that won't change while it's compiling. The new editor doesn't require this.

The key algorithms of the new editor tend to be logarithmic and related only to what's on-screen. Vastly better than the underlying functionality of the old editor.

Of course we can still screw it up, but the fundamentals are much better. In fact, the problems we've had so far tended to be where we were required to emulate the old editor's behaviors for code we didn't want to port to the new API.

If you have big files, you'll be much more likely to *want* that new editor than the reverse. Where we're likely to lose is on tiny files where the overhead of starting the new editor is going to be greater.

VSTS Lab Management is finally announced!

VSTS Lab Management team blog — Thu, 20 Nov 2008 09:37:37 GMT

After more than a year that we have been working on Lab Management, we have announced the product last

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Erik Cox — Mon, 08 Dec 2008 17:12:58 GMT

Love what you did with the quick search....I mean I had used that sort of thing in Eclipse..but since I put my focus on programming in

<a href="http://www.notionsolutions.com">VS</a> i had missed that feature..so I was more than just happy when I read what you have done...Cheers!

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Bz — Thu, 01 Jan 2009 10:37:03 GMT

Please, I beg you to provide an option to opt out of WPF editor!

I looked at another WPF app, Expression Blend that has a sloooooooow GUI. I mean like 250ms vs 20ms, but for a fast typist it is really annoying to be dealing with these little Java-like delays. Visual Studio has been getting slower with every release, so is this a joke calling it the new VC6 while adding WPF bloatware? Please focus on functionality and not on prettiness. It is silly that to add a feature like scalable font you have to replace a working editor with a rewrite which means new bugs and new performance issues. This endless cycle of rewrites and getting some new stuff mixed in with performance issues is getting tiring.

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

David Berg — Thu, 01 Jan 2009 22:19:22 GMT

Bz,

We didn't rewrite the editor just to add WPF support and scalable fonts. We also rewrote it to improve scalability for dealing with larger files, larger numbers of regions, and improve multi-threading support (see RICOM's comments above for more details).

Our expectation is that for small to medium sized files and projects you should see performance comparable to VS2008, and better performance for larger files and projects.

On your experience with Expression Blend, I agree that typing performance should be well under 250 ms. I'd like to understand what you're seeing a little better, if you can send me some more information (devperf@microsoft.com) about your system and where you see the performance problems, I'd appreciate it.

Regards,

David Berg - Microsoft Developer Division Performance Engineering Team

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Bz — Fri, 02 Jan 2009 09:06:43 GMT

David,

Thank you for your response. I tried Blend when it first came out. The GUI seemed a little less snappy so and I never used it again. The 250ms number was for a context menu inside of an edit box. Now, I ran xaml pad and that doesn't seem to be an issue anymore. Maybe performance was improved in .NET service packs.

My initial post may have been a little over the top - I'm sorry about that. I was deeply scarred by the "Updating Intellisense" issue. That makes me really worried anytime I hear about major changes to the IDE. It causes a knee jerk reaction against any changes.

I'll trust your performance predictions and get a faster computer.

Thank you for all of your great work.

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Armstrong — Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:56:02 GMT

Please the problem is I can not record from datein to CD please somthing wrong.

Code Focused Development in VS 2010

Somasegar's WebLog — Sun, 01 Mar 2009 06:00:00 GMT

In a blog post in November , I mentioned a feature called “Quick Search” - one of the code focused features

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Tanveer Badar — Fri, 06 Mar 2009 16:37:49 GMT

I want to chip in same thing as Bz said. I don't want myself typing letters into the editor while the IDE catches up. It puts conscious strain and frequent pauses for those bloody java IDEs to catch up on me. Don't turn VS into another of those.

re: Visual Studio 2010 - Code focused development and Lab Management

Clancy — Thu, 19 Nov 2009 15:35:46 GMT

Are there any new datagrid properties that will lock the header, or turn on vertical or horizontal scrollbars?