A 6 By Any Other Name…

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

galt — Fri, 16 Mar 2007 23:58:14 GMT

God I enjoy your posts... Great story arc, and even though I think the community still often doesn't agree with the ultimate decision, I think the information sharing helps combat the otherwise inevitable thought "what were they thinking?".

BTW, WM6 (professional edition) is feeling like a substantial upgrade, definitely not just a fresh coat of paint as some have panned it. Great job to all who worked on it.

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

Scott Yost — Sat, 17 Mar 2007 01:18:20 GMT

The part that is hardest to swallow for me is that the non-touch-screen devices have a richer security model than the touch-screen devices. So I have to explain that, if you want this or that security policy for your enterprise, you need to get the "Standard" version because the "Professional" version doesn't support it.

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

TOCA — Sat, 17 Mar 2007 16:54:45 GMT

"Windows Mobile 6, however, is still based on the previous version of CE."

And that's why the community liked to call it WM5.5 before the "6" became official, but after reading about all the new things in WM6, the name sort of makes sence, there deffenately are more changes, than when WM2003 became WM2003SE, but it's still not as radical, as going from WM2003(SE) to WM5.

The "Classic, Professional, and Standard" naming however?????

Classic I can understand, well sort of, they should have been Standard, or maybe not? But the word Professional is the one, that makes all the confusion, since it's no more pro, than the Standard.

Smartphone should be a banned name, since every cellphone today is reffered to as such, by the mannufactores, and resellers.

So maybe the marketers should have gone all the way, and renamed every thing, eaven the Windows Mobile, and PocketPC names, to something that makes more sence to the enduser?

Tommy

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

Joe Bruno — Sat, 17 Mar 2007 20:15:05 GMT

Is it possible to write programs that run on Windows Mobile 6, full stop? Or is it necessary to treat each flavour of it as a different operating system?

I'm asking because in a year's time the market share of Microsoft-based pocket device operating systems will be approximately: WM6 Standard 1%, WM6 Professional 1%, WM6 Classic 1%, Windows Mobile 6 30%, Windows Mobile 67%. This is, of course, the operating system as determined by actual users, which is the only thing that matters in the marketplace. If you demand that a customer go away and decide which version of WM6 he has before he buys your software, he will do half of what you ask. The first half.

The situation is similar on PCs, but there at least it is clearly possible to write programs for "Windows", meaning everything from 98 to Vista inclusive. As a programmer I have no problem in detecting OS versions at run-time... but will WM's packaging system accept a program that says it will work with "Windows Mobile Any Edition"?

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

MelSam — Sat, 17 Mar 2007 21:05:18 GMT

Joe Bruno:

Yes this is possible, and even done by a number of programs today. The packaging and distribution system for both - Standard and Professional is the CAB format. You can create a single CAB that installs on all WM6 devices. WM6 devices also use the same processor type, so the same binaries (.exe and .dll) can execute on all devices. There is nothing "stopping you" from running the same .exe on a Classic, Standard or Professional device. It takes a little more work on the developer's side to ensure that the app hasn't assumed a specific screen size, doesn't have a hard dependency on touch, and doesn't use certain touch-dependant controls that only exist on Professional. We (Microsoft) are trying to help developers go down this path by releasing code samples, white papers and other resources because we know this is what developers are going to want to do eventually.

One example of an app that does everything right and maintains a single binary for all devices is the Windows Live client (http://wls.live.com). Check it out.

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

SB — Sun, 18 Mar 2007 02:12:42 GMT

The example given is a case in point about what I don't like here though.. WLS has a workable interface from the point of view of a standard device... but using it on a professional device (ie with a touchscreen) it's not so great.

Take the maps part of the application, the only way you can zoom is by using the softkey and then hitting zoom in. I'd prefer a zoom slider overlayed that you can just slide.. or a double tap and strech of a 'zoom box' or anything graphical really.

I'm assuming they are left out because they wouldnt make sense on a non-touch device which is fair enough.

With the convergence of the two platforms which seems like the long term goal lots of applications are going to go this way and I think thats a big issue.

I'd like to see standard devices scrapped altogether but I realise that isn't going to happen, from what you said here and the earlier post about a similar issue with the PropertySheet control it sounds like the standard interface is actually going to be the more likely to win out which would be a huge huge mistake I think.

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

Andrew — Mon, 19 Mar 2007 09:56:14 GMT

You know how many things I have to make clear?!

Smartphone and PocketPC, WinCE and WM, WinCE 4.2 and Window Mobile 2003 (or maybe Smartphone 2003, PocketPC 2003, er, phone edition), WinCE 5.0 and WM 5.0 (or maybe WM 2005, Smartphone 2005, PocketPC 2005, er, phone edition), WinCE 6.0 and Windows Mobile 6 (or maybe WinCE 5.5/6? I don't know!!!).

And more...

Classic, standard and professional ...

and more...

How many naming will come out? Who knows?

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

MikeCal — Mon, 19 Mar 2007 19:01:19 GMT

galt, thanks!

Scott, not to mention profiles....

TOCA, yeah, I had assumed similar names as well.

Joe Bruno:

It's pretty easy to write a single program that works on everything from WM2003 Smartphone to WM6 Professional with everything in between. I've written a number of such apps.

We don't expect people to go away and figure out which version of our software to buy. In our experience, people's primary decisions come from the hardware, not the software. First they'll say, "Which do I like better, the Dash or the Treo?" Then after holding both, seeing how they fit in their pockets, comparing the keyboards, etc, if they're still undecided, they'll look at other factors like which version of the OS is on the devices.

Because the devices are tuned to the OS, we're not in a situation where you choose your hardware first then choose your OS version.

SB:

It's certainly possible to support both touch and keyboard nav in a single app and have it work on both Standard and Professional. It's just a matter of development time. And, once you've made everything work from the keyboard, it works on both touch screen devices and non-touch devices.

I'll confess to a certain degree of laziness here myself. All of the apps I write work on touch screen devices, but I rarely add touch support. Then again, when I write apps, I write them for myself first and other people second (it's a nice contrast to what I do for my job), and I care more about hardware navigation than touch.

Andrew, yes the marketing world is a complicated place. Imagine if you tried to keep track of the number of models of cars a major auto maker made in the last 5 years. It would be even more muddy. "No, cruise control was in the 2004 SLC, but not the 2004 SL. They didn't add it to the SL until 2005...." I will say that marketers change names all the time because it works. If it didn't work, they wouldn't do it.

Mike

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

Jeffrey Glen Jackson — Tue, 20 Mar 2007 21:42:37 GMT

I've been frustrated by the direction that WM devices have been taking over the years. First, they reduced the number of alarms from 4 to 3 (2002-2003). Then in WM5 you went on this obsession with wasting as much screen space as possible by permitting only two menu items on the bottom bar, so now many applications have to add another row to put their convenience buttons. This is made worse by the fact that VGA devices have all but vanished from the marketplace and the phone makers are changing everything over to horizontal (aka landscape) orientation, which causes the top and bottom bars to occupy even more space without providing any additional functionality or content. Oh, and you removed all the useful snooze durations. I dread every new WM release, because they are always major steps backwards in usability and functionality.

I suspect my i730 will be my last WM device. In the future, I imagine I'll go with a UMPC for all my PDA functionality, and just get as simple and cheap a phone as I can get.

So what's with the Windows Mobile 6 name?

Windows Mobile 6 — Wed, 21 Mar 2007 12:12:12 GMT

Mike Calligaro on the Windows Mobile Team blog writes an interesting piece about the naming of Windows Mobile 6 Professional and Stantard versions. It's quite interesting how and why Microsoft names these products and the reasoning behind them.It see

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

Zuana — Wed, 21 Mar 2007 13:59:26 GMT

It was quite an entertaining post. Thank you. From a recent article, I learnt that Windows Mobile 6 Professional has wonderful features. Its all possible because of SCIENCE.

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

igalan — Wed, 21 Mar 2007 15:43:30 GMT

Now the customers will call with questions like:

Customer: How can't I run software for Windows Mobile 6 *Classic* on my Windows Mobile 6 *Standard*? Isn't classic like legacy OS and standard just that, the standard?

Support: Uh, oh...

At least in the past the names gave a description of the main purpose of the device: Smartphone where phone oriented, PocetPC Phone Edition where PocketPC oriented with phone capabilities, and PocketPC no phone functions.

But we'll live with the new naming scheme, no matter how meaningless or confusing it is. Windows Mobile 5 Second Edition; and the flavours: Smartphone / PocketPC Phone Edition / Pocket PC seemed more appropriate to me. If a new Windows Mobile is created from Windows CE 6 which name is going to get?

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

MikeCal — Wed, 21 Mar 2007 19:39:12 GMT

igalan:

While "Classic" makes the most sense of the three names, the fact that software written for Classic might run on Pro but not Standard is definitely confusing. But where unit sales of phone devices have been seeing enormous growth for over the years, sales of devices without phones (outside of the vertical market, where names don't matter) have been rapidly declining. We needed to call Classic SOMETHING, but at the rate things are going, it's not really going to matter for very long.

As for what we'd call WM6 based on CE6, imagine the following dialog. This conversation didn't really happen, but it could have.

Me: Here's what we should do. Our next release should be identical to WM6, but be based on CE6. That's the quickest way to get us to the new OS.

Marketer: Um, why would that sell?

Me: Because the numbers would be the same then!

Marketer: <Pats me on the head> Good developer. Here's a donut. No go away write some text with semicolons in it. At least you're good at that.

(This is completely fictional. When I made the suggestion, I didn't get a donut for it....)

Mike

Windows Mobile Team explains the name change

John at myITforum.com — Thu, 22 Mar 2007 18:23:27 GMT

The Windows Mobile team as blogged explaining why the name change for Windows Mobile 6. It partly reads:

Names are changed EVERY SINGLE TIME!

Alex — Sat, 24 Mar 2007 06:46:34 GMT

This time, like every time before it, people try to explain (unsuccessfully) the new names, and no one seems to notice the fact that names have been changed EVERY SINGLE TIME.

Not a single time was new version name produced by simply incrementing a version number from previous release:

Palm-size PC

Pocket PC

Pocket PC 2002

Windows Mobile 2003 for Pocket PC

Windows Mobile 2003 Second Edition for Pocket PC

Windows Mobile 5.0 Pocket PC

Windows Mobile 6 Classic

I can bet the next version will be named anything but "Windows Mobile 7 Classic".

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

MikeCal — Mon, 26 Mar 2007 20:36:18 GMT

Well, you have to expect the version number/name to change. At least "Pocket PC" has been consistent for the last five releases (over seven years).

I don't think it's ever been anyone's goal to make a new version's number/name just be the previous version's number/name but incremented. That's just not how marketing works. You see the same behavior in cars, stereos, TVs, game consoles, etc.

Mike

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

joe — Wed, 28 Mar 2007 01:33:28 GMT

Pretty sure some car models have been around for a few *decades* with only the model year changing...

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

schjlatah — Wed, 28 Mar 2007 02:40:50 GMT

Duh, the next versions of WM* will be Vista Portable 2000, Vista Mobile XP, Vista To Go 2003 R2 SP1 or some retarded pun on the word vista: like "Horizon" or "Panorama" for micro-tablets, ultra-micro-tablets and ultra-micro-tablet-terminals.

But we all know after a few releases they will just come out with PC OS X, then sue Apple for post-facto copyright infringement. You will be able to tell which version is meant for phones because it will use a Banana icon to delineate bi-directional-speaking-device.

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

MikeCal — Thu, 29 Mar 2007 23:26:07 GMT

joe:

I'm sure there are some that I'm not thinking of. But, make sure we're talking about the same thing. If you're thinking, "Toyota Camry" then I'd argue that's the same naming scheme as "Microsoft PocketPC." Where you see cars changing from year to year is in all the different extra parts. LE, LX, LCX, LE Extended, LE Extended Special Edition etc. The point being that marketers change some part of the name to remind people that there's something new for them to look at/get excited about/buy. The reason they do this is simple: it works. If people didn't buy more when the name changed, marketers would stop changing names.

schjlatah:

I don't expect Windows Mobile to ever change its name to some derivative of "Vista." As I said in the original entry, though, I don't understand marketing well enough to know for sure.

However, if you were to compare Apple and Microsoft in terms of "who sues other people more," Microsoft would do very well.

Mike

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

Alex — Sat, 31 Mar 2007 22:17:06 GMT

> If people didn't buy more when the name changed,

> marketers would stop changing names.

Marketers are constantly thinking up more ways to justify their existence, and pointless name changing is one of such measures. It is probably detrimental for sales, but with people like you backing them up, the practice is unlikely to change.

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

Dominick — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 02:02:08 GMT

Hi. Do you or anyone else know if we will get Windows Mobile 6 for the Samsung i730? From what i understand it is being offered for free to vendors, but is there ANY WAY we can get them to make it avaliable for the i730? Thank you..

Dominick

dominickunderscore7777atyahoo

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

Dominick — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 02:05:07 GMT

I and many other HATE the horizontal keyboard, and WISHED Verizon would make the SGH-i760 GSM design for a CDMA version in the US..it has two cameras, and as good if not better specs than the SCH-i760, WITH the vertical keyboard. Its beautiful, and many forums say the same thing but they don't listen it seems AT ALL to their customers. We would really like to get WM6 and SDHC support on our i730, especially since the i760 looks like a downgrade in specs and has that annoying anti one handed landscape keyboard.

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

jmsoftware — Wed, 04 Apr 2007 17:14:37 GMT

Do you know if and when more controls will be added to the Smart Phone / Standard Version API?

Currently, I can not port my Pocket PC application to the Smart Phone because the Smart Phone API doesn't support tab pages or button controls.

I realize Smart Phones do not have a touch screen to select between the different tabs or buttons, but a Smart Phone user could scroll to a Tab Page or Button and then tap the Enter Button to select between the different tabs or buttons.

Thanks,

John

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

Max Shumov — Wed, 09 May 2007 21:43:17 GMT

Hmm. I've some thoughts about it.

I think that igalan is right about this:

"Now the customers will call with questions like:

Customer: How can't I run software for Windows Mobile 6 *Classic* on my Windows Mobile 6 *Standard*? Isn't classic like legacy OS and standard just that, the standard?

Support: Uh, oh..."

re: A 6 By Any Other Name…

Espen Riskedal — Wed, 27 Jun 2007 12:44:11 GMT

I feel for you Mike :) I guess we've all been there - the battle between development and marketing.

I agree with most of what you say here, but I do not agree with you when you say you couldn't do a better job in naming the product than marketing could.

You know the product - they don't. Being a developer you know how important names are. Whenever you create a function or a class you have to give it a name. Every day you name things. It's what developers are good at - any good developer anyways.

From the outside, the Windows CE and Windows Mobile namings are a complete mess. It does not get better with the "new" scheme they came up with now.

Here is a suggestion: Call it Windows Mobile. Then when it's installed on a device it adapts to the capabilities of the device. If it has a touchscreen it uses the touchscreen - if it has a GSM you can make calls with it. From a user perspective it's much easier if it's just called by ONE name.

From a developer perspective all we need to know is what capabilites the device has. We can check this and adapt our software accordingly.